TRYING HEAVIER BOLTS

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WNYBILL
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TRYING HEAVIER BOLTS

Post by WNYBILL » Wed Feb 21, 2018 2:43 pm

In an attempt to quiet my xbow, I want to try shooting heavier bolts/arrows. I limit my hunting shots to 40 yards and prefer 30.
1. What is the best/easiest/cheapest way? Buy custom arrows in the weight I want or adding weight to my present factory arrows?
2. What is the heaviest arrow I can use in my Axiom? How about the Grizzly?
3. Should I stay with the 20 inch arrow for the Axiom and the 18 inch for the Grizzly?
4. Should the arrow balance in the middle, or should they be front or rear heavy? And how much?
5. Should I consider aluminum?

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nchunterkw
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Re: TRYING HEAVIER BOLTS

Post by nchunterkw » Wed Feb 21, 2018 4:54 pm

The cheapest way would be to add a heavier BH to your factory arrows, but you will be very limited. Typically with Excal a 150gr BH gets you to around 400gr total weight, so if you can find some bigger heads you could gain a little more weight.

I'd suggest buying some shafts and components and experimenting a little. Gold Tip Nitro Pros are in the 14GPI range and Easton FMJs are 13.7GPI. I'd probably pick the Eastons over the GT. IThey have a 120gr brass insert. I used these to make a 525gr arrow for bison. At that time they did not sell bare shafts, so I had to buy 22" FMJs with Al inserts, and also but the brass inserts. Then I cut them off to 20" and installed the brass. This setup would put you at:
20" * 13.7 = 274gr
120gr insert
~20gr for vanes
~10gr for a flat nock
424 total weight right there plus a 100 gr head = 525gr.....maybe a little too heavy for the Axiom or Grizzly. But Easton makes some lighter brass inserts as well.

To answer your questions,1) see above, 2) I would think a 450gr arrow would be really nice out of those bows 3) I'd stick with both 20" and 18", 4) you want the arrow about 15% - 20% front heavy. 5) Al wuld be fine too. Less expensive and probably heavier. The FMJs I described above are Al over carbon.

Good luck
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XB I GO
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Re: TRYING HEAVIER BOLTS

Post by XB I GO » Wed Feb 21, 2018 5:09 pm

For my Axiom, I use BEZS's with the 110 grain insert and a 150 grain head. These are 20". They weigh 470 grains and they are extremely accurate and quiet. The weight is FOC.

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Re: TRYING HEAVIER BOLTS

Post by Hunt it » Wed Feb 21, 2018 6:54 pm

I use a 2219 aluminum shaft with a Carbon Express 4000 carbon shaft glued inside the 2219. A 100 gun brass insert up front and 100 gr G5 striker gets me 700gr total. Takes a lot of noise away and hits like sledgehammer

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BrotherRon
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Re: TRYING HEAVIER BOLTS

Post by BrotherRon » Wed Feb 21, 2018 9:18 pm

I have been using Executioners with the 310 and Zombies or Spynal Tapps with the 330 with very accurate results.
I have 110 grain brass inserts and use 100 grain tips with the 310 and 125 grain tips with the 330.
I will be doing some testing with the 310 in a few weeks and will probably start using Zombies or Spynal Tapps for both.
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Re: TRYING HEAVIER BOLTS

Post by PublicLandHunter1 » Wed Feb 21, 2018 9:34 pm

I started shooting 22 inch FMJ out of my M405 with 150 grain broadheads and standard inserts. They were extremely accurate; but at 40 yards they started to drop a lot. I then cut them down to 18.5 inches still shooting the 150 grain broadheads and standard inserts but I noticed the accuracy declined. I switched to 20 inch BEE with brass inserts and 150 grain broadheads and those come in around 475 total grains. They shoot well and I did not notice a difference in noise or vibration from the FMJ. If I buy FMJs again I will go with the 20 inch version. If someone came out with a small diameter, heavy carbon bolt as straight as BEE/BEZ/Spynal Tapps I would shoot them. Had great results with the Easton micro series 10grain/inch arrows out of my compound.
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xcaliber
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Re: TRYING HEAVIER BOLTS

Post by xcaliber » Wed Feb 21, 2018 9:43 pm

First off, are you trying to get one length for both bows? If yes, measure the bow to stirrup where the tip will fall when cocked on the longer model, then the shorter one. If you can find a happy medium where you CANNOT slip your boot under the arrow great. Maybe 18", maybe not. The next thing is what is your hunting preference? Treestand? Do you hang your bow on a hook? You need about one inch gap between stirrup and broadhead to hang the bow without clanking it when a shoot presents.
My advise, go as long as possible. If you have to use two different lengths, it is what it is!
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longbow joe
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Re: TRYING HEAVIER BOLTS

Post by longbow joe » Wed Feb 21, 2018 9:49 pm

My vixen 2 is slower than your bow and im shooting zombies with a 110 insert and a 125 head im about 430 grains still blows thru deer. I dont really want to go any heavier they seem like the perfect combo. Im about 265 fps. I havnt experienced any jumping the string inside 30 yards. I like a heavier arrow l will go heavy every time over a lighter one.
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WNYBILL
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Re: TRYING HEAVIER BOLTS

Post by WNYBILL » Thu Feb 22, 2018 10:33 am

Thank you, this is the kind of information I was looking for. Sounds as if most of you recommend the arrow being nose heavy, seems like that would cause more shaft flex upon launch?????? But I have no experience, so I believe you guys.

Sounds as if I want custom arrows because I really don't want to start building them. Is there a forum member who could build me some 20 inch aluminum shaft bolts that will weigh 425 with a 100 gr point? That way I could go to 450 with a 125 point. That would give me some room to experiment.

I understand needing a minimum length......... could you replace an 18 inch with a 20 without a loss of accuracy or efficiency. Point past the stirrup is not a problem for me.

Thanks again.

Bill

catclr
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Re: TRYING HEAVIER BOLTS

Post by catclr » Thu Feb 22, 2018 12:08 pm

WNYBILL wrote:
Thu Feb 22, 2018 10:33 am
Sounds as if most of you recommend the arrow being nose heavy, seems like that would cause more shaft flex upon launch??????
Thanks again.
Bill
Bill, The above is true on longer arrows, that's why I went to shorter arrows, as you have less flex when fired, and less flex when the arrow hits the target. I'm shooting 15 1/2" and with 100 gr. heads comes in at 414 gr. and these shoot same hole out to 40 yds., and I'm well pleased with them.
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nchunterkw
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Re: TRYING HEAVIER BOLTS

Post by nchunterkw » Thu Feb 22, 2018 1:06 pm

catclr wrote:
Thu Feb 22, 2018 12:08 pm
WNYBILL wrote:
Thu Feb 22, 2018 10:33 am
Sounds as if most of you recommend the arrow being nose heavy, seems like that would cause more shaft flex upon launch??????
Thanks again.
Bill
Bill, The above is true on longer arrows, that's why I went to shorter arrows, as you have less flex when fired, and less flex when the arrow hits the target. I'm shooting 15 1/2" and with 100 gr. heads comes in at 414 gr. and these shoot same hole out to 40 yds., and I'm well pleased with them.
This is true to an extent. Arrows flex about the center of pressure (for us the center of the arrow) upon launch. But don't confuse crossbow arrows with vert box arrows. The spines we are shooting are very much higher than vert bow arrows so the flex at launch is much less.....but still there. However, the arrow flexes about the point of balance when it hits something. By making them "nose heavy" you move the balance point forward and thus the distance from tip to pt. of balance is shorter making it harder to flex at impact. This is one reason why I want the stiffest arrow I can get....it helps penetration.
Keith
"The difference between Theory and Reality is small...in theory"

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longbow joe
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Re: TRYING HEAVIER BOLTS

Post by longbow joe » Thu Feb 22, 2018 4:18 pm

You can get 20" 2219 s prefletched camo from any excaliber vender. Or 2219 magnums from a jillion places on the internet l use amazon they are all factory fletched. . You will not get propper foc with a 125 head you need at least 150 grain with the alluminum insert . Yes the 125 will work but a 150 grain will outshoot the,125 at distance every time and better yet a175. Excalibur has tested the 150 grain point on the 2219 and thats why they sell them .Stop worrying about a few grains at 30 yards it is an issue of an inch . Go heavy or go home. Lol.lf your worried about weight shoot the carbons.
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