A question for the accuracy nuts
Moderator: Excalibur Marketing Dude
A question for the accuracy nuts
While I would love to be able to put in the time to develop the skill to split the hairs on a gnat at 150 yards in a heavy crosswind, the truth is I don't have it right now. The best I can manage these days is to be good 'nuff for hunting out to 40 yards with confidence. Also, I drink too much coffee. I realize there are a lot of factors in attaining pinpoint accuracy, such as particular bow/string/point/arrow/scope combination, type of rest, not to mention technique and whether or not you've upset the local volcano deity, which I may have done. I am curious about a thing, though. I've noticed with my Micro 335 that my groups are a bit loose at 20 yards, but get super tight at 30. Could this have to do with the arrow's relatively stiff spine plus the short, violent stroke of the Micro and the distance it takes for the arrow to normalize in flight? Any other thoughts?
I'm shooting 16" BBEs (.001) with 100 grain points with a heavy insert and good FOC. I haven't noticed the same phenomenon with my Matrix 330 shooting the same arrow.
I'm shooting 16" BBEs (.001) with 100 grain points with a heavy insert and good FOC. I haven't noticed the same phenomenon with my Matrix 330 shooting the same arrow.
-
- Posts: 4970
- Joined: Sun Nov 24, 2013 11:32 pm
- Location: Coquitlam, British Columbia
Re: A question for the accuracy nuts
What you're describing can have many causes. I would look at checking one thing at a time. First, take only 1 arrow. ONE. Dial that arrow into the X ring at 20 yards. If it's hitting the dime every time at 20 yards, shoot that same arrow at 30 yards, 40 yards, etc.. That would be the first step. Actually, your very first step is to take your allen wrench and make sure all your fasteners are tight. If you can't group with a single arrow I would check your limb tiller and also check your limbs for cracks. Also, a scope issue may be possible. Certainly, make sure all fasteners are tight, then the solo arrow.
Paul
Paul
You're only paranoid if everyone isn't out to get you.
Keep your friends close and your enemies closer.
My enemy's friend is also my enemy.
Keep your friends close and your enemies closer.
My enemy's friend is also my enemy.
Re: A question for the accuracy nuts
Speaking of normalizing in flight, what type of fletching are you using and how is it fletched? Straight, helical, etc.
My Micro 335 is a tack driver with 16" BE Zombies with a 92gr brass insert and 2" Blazers fletched helical.
My Micro 335 is a tack driver with 16" BE Zombies with a 92gr brass insert and 2" Blazers fletched helical.
Micro Wolverine/Matrix 350 SE
Recovering Excalaholic
Recovering Excalaholic
Re: A question for the accuracy nuts
I was a victim of target panic when shooting vertical bows and saw exactly what you describe. Seems that it looked very easy to hit bulls at 20 yds so I was sloppy on my execution and follow through. When I got out to 40 yds my groups tightened up because I was trying to be smooth and watch the arrow all the way to the target. Just a thought...
Re: A question for the accuracy nuts
I would say that spine recovery should self correct well within 20 yards. Check all fasteners as suggested, then sort arrows by numbering them and finding the most accurate by shooting only one, then another, etc. You might have a flyer in the group.
It’s not the way you rock, it’s the way that you roll!
- AJ01
- Posts: 2504
- Joined: Fri Nov 24, 2017 10:09 am
- Location: Deep in the Heart of the East Texas Piney Woods!
Re: A question for the accuracy nuts
Listen to Paul!! He's got the answer. I know it sounds like a pain in the backside, but it's the only way to know for sure!!
“Life should not be a journey to the grave with the intention of arriving safely in a pretty and well preserved body, but rather to skid in broadside in a cloud of smoke, thoroughly used up, totally worn out and loudly proclaiming "Wow, What a Ride!
Re: A question for the accuracy nuts
This seems like a likely culprit. While I do have a screw loose, all the ones on my bow are snug as a signed portrait of Justin Bieber in a teenage girl's arms. It's quite possible I'm less careful with close shots. I'll have to pay attention to that. Also, I should spend some good one-on-one time with all my arrows. I may have a moody one.Smong2000 wrote: ↑Sat Feb 29, 2020 9:16 amI was a victim of target panic when shooting vertical bows and saw exactly what you describe. Seems that it looked very easy to hit bulls at 20 yds so I was sloppy on my execution and follow through. When I got out to 40 yds my groups tightened up because I was trying to be smooth and watch the arrow all the way to the target. Just a thought...
-
- Posts: 457
- Joined: Sat Aug 18, 2018 8:10 pm
- Location: Sout. Illinois
Re: A question for the accuracy nuts
Sounds like the same problem I have, if I want pinpoint accuracy I get my son or oldest grandson to split hairs for me, seems they do better from my bench. My youngest s on has always been a better shot than me.
matrix 380, 18" BEZS, Boostring
micro 315, 17" BE Execs. Vixenmaster
Axiom SMF, FIRE BOLTS Vixenmaster
micro 315, 17" BE Execs. Vixenmaster
Axiom SMF, FIRE BOLTS Vixenmaster
-
- Posts: 4970
- Joined: Sun Nov 24, 2013 11:32 pm
- Location: Coquitlam, British Columbia
Re: A question for the accuracy nuts
Here's a little tidbit that may be helpful. Years ago when I shot competitive 3D, I used a fine tipped metal marker to name each arrow. For example, I was a huge UFC fan so I named each arrow after a fighter. The reason being that it was easier to remember a name than a number or letter. If 'Randy Couture' was consistently hitting high or right that was easier to remember than #3 hitting high or right.
Paul
Paul
You're only paranoid if everyone isn't out to get you.
Keep your friends close and your enemies closer.
My enemy's friend is also my enemy.
Keep your friends close and your enemies closer.
My enemy's friend is also my enemy.
-
- Posts: 4260
- Joined: Sat Jun 06, 2015 9:55 pm
- Location: south eastern pa (bucks county)
Re: A question for the accuracy nuts
Paul l agree ... that's how my mind works also.
But....mine would be cheesesteak....bacon burger then michelob ultra etc...
But....mine would be cheesesteak....bacon burger then michelob ultra etc...
Vixen 2, metal ibex,Phoenix,sapphire,matrix 330 ,matrix 355 ,vortex and baby grand piano y25 relayer.
Trigger tecs,leupold crossbones and nikon bolts.
Zombie slayers and mostly swat broadheads.
Trigger tecs,leupold crossbones and nikon bolts.
Zombie slayers and mostly swat broadheads.
Re: A question for the accuracy nuts
Great idea. I could use politicians to make it even easier: Bernie Sanders hits far left. Mitch McConnell hits far right. Susan Collins hits consistently a little to the right. Tulsi Gabbard hits all over the place. Rudy Giuliani is high all the time. Problem is, I wouldn't have a name for any hitting dead center.paulaboutform wrote: ↑Mon Mar 02, 2020 10:43 amHere's a little tidbit that may be helpful. Years ago when I shot competitive 3D, I used a fine tipped metal marker to name each arrow. For example, I was a huge UFC fan so I named each arrow after a fighter. The reason being that it was easier to remember a name than a number or letter. If 'Randy Couture' was consistently hitting high or right that was easier to remember than #3 hitting high or right.
Paul
-
- Posts: 4260
- Joined: Sat Jun 06, 2015 9:55 pm
- Location: south eastern pa (bucks county)
Re: A question for the accuracy nuts
Lol
Vixen 2, metal ibex,Phoenix,sapphire,matrix 330 ,matrix 355 ,vortex and baby grand piano y25 relayer.
Trigger tecs,leupold crossbones and nikon bolts.
Zombie slayers and mostly swat broadheads.
Trigger tecs,leupold crossbones and nikon bolts.
Zombie slayers and mostly swat broadheads.
- AJ01
- Posts: 2504
- Joined: Fri Nov 24, 2017 10:09 am
- Location: Deep in the Heart of the East Texas Piney Woods!
Re: A question for the accuracy nuts
When's lunch????????? I'm starving just thinking about the menu!!!longbow joe wrote: ↑Mon Mar 02, 2020 1:05 pmPaul l agree ... that's how my mind works also.
But....mine would be cheesesteak....bacon burger then michelob ultra etc...
“Life should not be a journey to the grave with the intention of arriving safely in a pretty and well preserved body, but rather to skid in broadside in a cloud of smoke, thoroughly used up, totally worn out and loudly proclaiming "Wow, What a Ride!
- nchunterkw
- Posts: 2906
- Joined: Sat Dec 24, 2011 11:21 am
- Location: Wake Forest, NC
- Contact:
Re: A question for the accuracy nuts
Another thing to consider is shooting each arrow with a different vane in the channel. It really matters. I fletch everything with 3 different colored vanes. Easier to get the correct vane in the channel. IMO no reason to use 2 and 1, or 3 of the same colorpaulaboutform wrote: ↑Mon Mar 02, 2020 10:43 amHere's a little tidbit that may be helpful. Years ago when I shot competitive 3D, I used a fine tipped metal marker to name each arrow. For example, I was a huge UFC fan so I named each arrow after a fighter. The reason being that it was easier to remember a name than a number or letter. If 'Randy Couture' was consistently hitting high or right that was easier to remember than #3 hitting high or right.
Paul
Keith
Stand by the roads and look, and ask for the ancient paths; where the good way is,
and walk in it and find rest for your souls. - Jer 6:16
Micro 335 & 355
deerboyarchery.wixsite.com/trinitystrings
[email protected]
<{{{><
Stand by the roads and look, and ask for the ancient paths; where the good way is,
and walk in it and find rest for your souls. - Jer 6:16
Micro 335 & 355
deerboyarchery.wixsite.com/trinitystrings
[email protected]
<{{{><
Re: A question for the accuracy nuts
I obsess over accuracy. The answers given here are excellent , IMO.
Just a few additional thoughts:
1)the finer the range marks, the more precise the aiming,
2) the greater the magnification, the more precise the aiming,
3) head centered in the scope reduces parallex concerns,
4) all else equal, I've found longer arrows do better for me,
5) don’t count out AL arrows - my most accurate arrows are 23 1/2” , 60g Ethics insert, 125g field point, SK300s in offset, lightest possible AL nock, actually an insert, shot out of my BD400, approach 1” 3-shot groups @100 yards,
6) use great rests -rear and front and good trigger control
7) check your tiller, both cocked and uncocked - balanced limbs help accuracy
If you are trying for the most accurate setup, remove yourself as much as possible - see #6 above
9) Only after optimizing your setup, start optimizing yourself.
10) It’s been generally conceded , that the longer the limbs, the more accurate the crossbow. At least with Excaliburs. A Micro isn’t as accurate as a Matrix/BD as a Vortex, etc. a Micro is more of a carbine. Possibly, the longer arrows may negate this somewhat.
11) Arrows are important. Spine indexed, matched, stiff as possible, heavier FOCs, no more vane steering than necessary, extreme consistency of construction.
12) I stated, “a few” , so I’ll stop here.
I don’t know why the smiley is on #8
Just a few additional thoughts:
1)the finer the range marks, the more precise the aiming,
2) the greater the magnification, the more precise the aiming,
3) head centered in the scope reduces parallex concerns,
4) all else equal, I've found longer arrows do better for me,
5) don’t count out AL arrows - my most accurate arrows are 23 1/2” , 60g Ethics insert, 125g field point, SK300s in offset, lightest possible AL nock, actually an insert, shot out of my BD400, approach 1” 3-shot groups @100 yards,
6) use great rests -rear and front and good trigger control
7) check your tiller, both cocked and uncocked - balanced limbs help accuracy
If you are trying for the most accurate setup, remove yourself as much as possible - see #6 above
9) Only after optimizing your setup, start optimizing yourself.
10) It’s been generally conceded , that the longer the limbs, the more accurate the crossbow. At least with Excaliburs. A Micro isn’t as accurate as a Matrix/BD as a Vortex, etc. a Micro is more of a carbine. Possibly, the longer arrows may negate this somewhat.
11) Arrows are important. Spine indexed, matched, stiff as possible, heavier FOCs, no more vane steering than necessary, extreme consistency of construction.
12) I stated, “a few” , so I’ll stop here.
I don’t know why the smiley is on #8