coyote bounty for all of Ontario

[swiftfox]

Has any one heard of a proposal to have a bounty on yotes for all of Ontario. Not just Bruce, Huron counties. I was at work today and a person mentioned that a memeber of parliment is going to bring forward a bill for a bounty on coyotes for all of Ontario?

sorry American friends but this is a Canadian question.

Swiftfox

[wheelie]

No good the bounty for Bruce and Huron anyways, you pretty much have to give up your first born child to get it. Therefore very few even try to collect it.

[N8tr Boy]

We already have "hunters" trespassing on private property to hunt rabbits, this will make it worse. I met a "hunter" on property I have signature for with owners son. The guy was driving around the farm willie-nillie not caring where he drove and said those coyote tracks are old ,at least a week. I said well there is some that are 2 days old. He couldn't care less who he ticked off he "is the Great Hunter".

[swiftfox]

N8tr Boy that was one of my concerns as the excuse I have heard most over the last three years already is " I am just hunting yotes".......therefore get the h -ll out of my tree stand and by the way you are trespassing.

If the bounty goes to 200 per yote everyone and there friend are going to go where ever they think they can get away with going. Last year we had guys hunting yotes on a gravel road shooting out of the back of a pickup.

It will be intresting to see if this legislation goes through.

swiftfox

[JRS]

I believe this is the story you are talking about. Heard it on the radio yesterday.

http://www.woodstocksentinelreview.com/ ... ?e=2919851

[Pydpiper]

Not very often I will say this, but I agree with the MNR.
"The answer, in our opinion, is not population control, but rather removal of a specific animal that is disrupting the farm," says Greg Cull, an MNR fish and wildlife specialist.
Keeping in mind that the topic here is about the ones that are getting too close, and not just because they are predators. We as hunters tend to want to reduce the population because of how they can affect the game we hunt, but you have to remember that this proposed incentive has absolutely nothing to do with that. It is about the coyotes that are encroaching on to farms and homes with little fear of humans. Not all coyotes are like that. If a 500 acre farm is supporting 6 coyotes, and one of them gets bold enough to leave it's comfort zone then that animal becomes a problem animal, but it doesn't mean that the other 5 have to be shot to fix the problem.
Again, you have to remember that this proposal is being designed by city folk, to help city folk. A hunters perspective is definitely necessary, but not appreciated by those in need.
I see "problem" coyotes on a daily basis, they are not like the rest, they are not like the ones who hunt mice and rabbits, the problem coyotes are the ones that decide to sneak an easy meal, go against hundreds of years of biology and go towards their greatest threat, opposed to away from it, man.
Monday night the wife and I were woke by a pair of coyotes under our bedroom window, 1 or 2 in the morning, because I back on to a couple thousand acres of farmland it was nothing more than a minor inconvenience. If that animal had done that during the day, It would have been labeled a problem animal and dealt with accordingly. It was a cold night, it came to my house to drink from the melted snow under the exhaust of our furnace.
I often get calls to attend farms where a single animal will break from the pack and approach a farm house, or cattle, or homes at times that are not regular for them, once that coyote is dispatched the problem is over, even though the land still supports a healthy number of coyotes.
There is a big difference between a problem coyote and a coyote.
They are being pushed from their land by the constant building of homes and subdivisions, they have no choice but to become more apparent to the public. The problem arises when a city family builds a house in the country and determines that hunting can not be done, then complain when Fi-fi is found half eaten beside the fence. Or by farmers who remove fence-rows and bush-lots to sneak in a couple extra rows of corn. Those are the people who are pushing for a bounty, again it is important to remember that.
In my opinion, I think that we just need more hunters. You do not need to be successful at destroying them, we just need to remind these things that they are not at the top of the food chain, we are.

[Mr. Dynamite]

Quotes from http://www.woodstocksentinelreview.com/ ... ?e=2919851

"The answer, in our opinion, is not population control, but rather removal of a specific animal that is disrupting the farm," says Greg Cull, an MNR fish and wildlife specialist.

So, should someone be kind enough to call them, and let them know what they are doing to the deer herd so they can come and remove all those killer coyotes also?

The MNR expects the coyote population to drop naturally over the next several years due to natural declines in their food supply and an epidemic of mange that breaks out any time the population reaches a critical level.

True, animal populations control themselves...but what will be the cost to farmers and hunters before we reach the "natural decline in their food supply"? That sounds good, lets wait around until the coyote population is running around full of mange and starting to drop dead. A pleasant idea.

"The group Coyote Watch Canada opposes bounty programs. The organization says coyotes are often blamed for livestock kills that are not their fault. CWC says farmers often bring the problem on themselves by leaving carcasses lying around unburied."

"Dang Momma, the chikenzes is all deadh. Leave 'em thar Boah, we'ill see if them'ill come back to life in a couple uh days."

Do they really want to portray farmer like that? As bumbling idiots who really have no idea what kills their animals, and then leave their farms littered with their own dead livestock and poultry? Farmers I am related to are not like that, neither are the farms I have been to or the ones I hunt/have hunted.

Look at how they are portraying farmers! I think that rather than proving farmers to be idiots, they are proving that they are a bunch of PETA animal activists, and when are those types ever in touch with the real world and problems of wildlife management.

I never disliked a coyote until I saw one that had killed a week old buck fawn, and then ran off chasing a hen turkey and her young, and never bothered to come back to even eat the fawn. On my uncle's farm - where they do not have dead decaying animals lying about - he has even had them stalk him, but thankfully there have never been enough at once to feel brave enough to confront him as happened this season with the guy in Woodstock.

[Pydpiper]

Mr. Dynamite, there are two very clear and separate issues here.
Coyotes kill, it is how they survive. But the article is about the ones who have stopped chasing fair game and have taken an easy road, domestic animals. Killing for the sake of killing is not typical of a coyote, it is an unfortunate thing that happened on that farm, but certainly not normal. A cat, yes.
The proposed bounty is about the animals that are encroaching, not the ones that are killing deer (as they have for hundreds and hundreds of years).
Historically it is not normal for the media to speak up about hunting let alone make an attempt at supporting it (bounty), the reason they are doing this is because it is about them, not you, not deer, just them. The minute you try to tell these same closed minded people that killing coyotes is going to allow you to kill more precious deer is the minute they will pull the proverbial carpet out from under you.
Let them have this, them convince the public that it is a necessary deed, then take advantage of it. How often have you ever seen the media support hunting? It simply doesn't happen. However, since it is beginning to affect them and they can come out looking like they are helping they will support it, run with it.
Once they push this through, then complain about the deer, and the turkeys and all the other stuff coyotes are supposed to eat. There are no drive-thru's in the wild, they will take what they can get, the proposed goal is to eliminate the bold ones, the ones that create danger to people, and affect other income (farms), not wild game.
The public will support a massive move on coyotes if they think it will benefit them, but if they think it is to ensure we have a healthy deer population to hunt, we can say goodbye to any support.
Oh, and tell your uncle to get a gun!

[Mr. Dynamite]

He does carry one. And when they hear him shooting at rabbits or ducks, depending on the season, he said they come in to investigate rather than go away!

there are two very clear and separate issues here

I see the difference you point out, but I view them as very closely tied together.

I do not imagine that in an area with lower coyote numbers deer or livestock are ever approached by a coyote. However, when there are enough that the mice, rabbits and feral house cats start to wise up and be scarce, their hunger drives them to attempt prey that they would not usually. Not only will they attempt bigger prey, they will seek for food in areas they would not usually - ie. close to man. The more there are, the more there will be who are not afraid of man.

You took the cake, though. I hope they do push this through, and then we will be sure to take advantage of it and kill some more deer

[RDPress]

A bounty is going to cause far more problems than it will do good. The best method is education in the hunting community regarding why everyone should not only monitor the number of deer or other species on the properties they hunt, but monitor the coyote population as well and take appropriate action.

All a bounty is going to do is encourage some people looking to make a quick buck to trespass and shoot every dog they see.

[Mr. Dynamite]

How much would the bounty even realistically be? Couple bucks a hide?

[wheelie]

How much would the bounty even realistically be? Couple bucks a hide?

Was talk of $200. each. Start freezing the ears incase. LOL

[DARTONATOR]

Look guys ! An overabundance of coyotes is a problem. I have been an avid deer hunter for 33 years and when the deer hunting season ends each year, I swing over to coyote hunting. I have logged over a million hours hunting these things on foot and feel pretty qualified making a few statements. First of all, some of these executives sitting up in their lofty offices think they know what is going on, wrong ! Our area was hit with mange for the last four years and I yet have to see a reduction in the numbers. You would not believe the number of coyotes we shot that looked black (no hair on them) that were running around in minus 10 degrees and still living. The mange did not kill the coyotes off. This year, the coyotes are up even more. We are pushing at least five coyotes from every 60 acre woodlot. This problem will not go away. When the winter gets really cold and the food starts to dwindle, the lesser coyotes get chased off of the range by the more dominant coyotes . These lesser coyotes get pushed into the city and all other spots you normally do not see coyotes. These coyotes are the ones that are causing problems. Can't shoot these ones, they are within city limits. There should be a 25 dollar bounty on all coyotes and trappers should get 50 dollars. This would allow the trapper to once again make some money on his hides and help the hunter recover some of the money for his shells. It would greatly reduce the population of coyotes which is the best for everyone.

[fratri]

Maybe our coyote population is extremely high as many claim, but I go out every weekend and call for them and try and hunt them down, there can't be that many, a crisis status IMO, don't think so.......I can be wrong but I just don't see it...I think I am pretty good at it and I only score once in a blue moon....I rarely see any at all. I do a lot of bow hunting, small game hunting and go for bush walks all the time, and I can count the amount of coyotes I see in a season in one hand. Definitely see more deer than coyote.... Anyway if there is any one having coyote problems and needs help getting rid of them, give me a call. I will be more than happy to come out for free and help you get rid of the problem. Setting a bounty is only going to push some normally law abiding people to across the line. Hunting for the money is not why I or most people go out... just my 2 cents...

[Pydpiper]

"problem" coyotes are typically just shot, not a lot of hunting involved. They are routine and predictable, a very different dog than the ones you would try to randomly hunt in a bush setting. Most of my work calls are as predictable as the coyote, the farmer/homeowner has the schedule down pretty good, and that is a good indicator of an animal that is about to become an issue, if it hasn't already.
These animals are dispatched fairly easily, half the time I don't even bother to shut off my truck or put on camo. The only time they can put up a good fight is if they had been shot at before, over-called or called with something that set off red flags for them. Like any other dog, they are easily trained and have the potential to learn fast. If I run in to problems the first thing I ask is "who shot at him already?", usually turns out to be his son with an old Cooey that has been under the tractor seat for 3 generations.
That is a very different situation than a random stand in the woods or a field. The majority of coyotes haven't seen people before, they are out doing what their breeding has evolved in to over the years, a much tougher hunt. For those I will spend a couple days scouting before taking up a serious stand, when they are around for a bit, there is a reason, find the reason and take advantage of it. usually a food supply or a water source that has appeared after a long cold snap.
90% of my coyotes are because I was invited to the property, I have only knocked on one door to gain permission, and that was because the dog I was after went under a fence and I wasn't about to trespass. I have a great reputation with the farmers here(S/W Ontario), I attend agricultural meetings as a guest speaker to help keep people informed and I also get referred by the MNR when people make complaints. I have been hunting for a living for over 10 years, it is my only source of income, and like anybody else's career choice, I succeed because I am very good at what I do. I detest being indoors, I doubt I will quit what I am doing any time soon. Farmers know that when I show up that the problem is about to end, it will come with a fee, but it is minimal compared to the damage they undertook before I got the call. I have seen a whole lot of damage, not just from the coyotes, but by the livestock when they get fired up.
From a recreational standpoint, I am a believer in scouting. I could hunt every day (I do) and have a substantial drop in my success by not putting a couple days of scouting in before a serious stand. I also have a healthy population of crows around here, they are like an aerial alarm when the coyotes are moving, not even the most sly of coyotes can escape the eyes of a few crows.
The tool I count on the most with coyotes is the solunar calendar, it is hit and miss with lots of other animals, but with coyotes I would bet my livelihood on it, and I have.
Having said that, I have never seen a deer that has been taken down by a coyote. I have seen them feed on carcases of dead deer (usually after a shotgun hunt), but never one that had fallen only to coyotes.
Between appointments I like to drop in on farmers and pick their brain on their position on coyotes, they are often open to the conversation and once they realize that I am not there to ask for anything (like permission) they share some of the most grounded and insightful information you could want. And quite often when you treat them with the respect they deserve it will open a door, if not with him then with a fellow farmer that he has breakfast with. Half the time they will bring me indoors for coffee, or to show photos of him in his prime hunting years, and tours of rusty old gun safes.
Just like anything else in this world, in order to be successful in your endeavors you need to put in your time.
I hope everyone gets success out there, our coyotes here are one of the toughest hunts you could dedicate yourself to, if only they tasted better.