Slooowww 380

[Starvin' Hillbilly]

I got a 355 that turns out an honest 335 w/ a 400 grn arra, never even thought about pushing a 350 grn arra through it. Jus like factory ammo in a rifle . . . it says 3000 fps but through a chrony (3 different) 2882 fps . . . even outdoor writer craig boddington said he got 2800 w/ a 180 nosler partition w/ a healthy dose of IMR 4831 out of an 30-06. . . for an elk load, I copied and pasted his load, down to the brass, I turned the brass and duplicated it. I could only get 2600 and some change. Even kodabow advertises their Rhino at 350 fps, but w/ their arra of 400 grn . . . 330 fps! . . .salesmanship! plane and simple.

were all lead to believe if we buy this or that it will help us kill the game were hunting. honestly if we had to carry everything they said that works we couldn't. I do agree that if we fork out the skrimped, saved, hard hidden cash we should get what we pay for, but in reality it wont happen. My wife . . . of 24 yrs . . .love her to death and I accept her faults, and she puts up w/ mine.
as my great granddad said "face powders atract'em but the bake'n powders hold'em "

But . . . my 355 is deadly accurate and blooded, my elk load I can clover leaf 3 rounds @ 100 yards, and wife . . . I cant see being married to another! . . .make the best of it . . . the world still turns.

-ken

sorry so winded

[amythntr]

I got a 355 that turns out an honest 335 w/ a 400 grn arra, never even thought about pushing a 350 grn arra through it. Jus like factory ammo in a rifle . . . it says 3000 fps but through a chrony (3 different) 2882 fps . . . even outdoor writer craig boddington said he got 2800 w/ a 180 nosler partition w/ a healthy dose of IMR 4831 out of an 30-06. . . for an elk load, I copied and pasted his load, down to the brass, I turned the brass and duplicated it. I could only get 2600 and some change. Even kodabow advertises their Rhino at 350 fps, but w/ their arra of 400 grn . . . 330 fps! . . .salesmanship! plane and simple.

were all lead to believe if we buy this or that it will help us kill the game were hunting. honestly if we had to carry everything they said that works we couldn't. I do agree that if we fork out the skrimped, saved, hard hidden cash we should get what we pay for, but in reality it wont happen. My wife . . . of 24 yrs . . .love her to death and I accept her faults, and she puts up w/ mine.
as my great granddad said "face powders atract'em but the bake'n powders hold'em "

But . . . my 355 is deadly accurate and blooded, my elk load I can clover leaf 3 rounds @ 100 yards, and wife . . . I cant see being married to another! . . .make the best of it . . . the world still turns.

-ken

sorry so winded

.... Yes, so true!

Anthony

[MickB]

Jus like factory ammo in a rifle . . . it says 3000 fps but through a chrony (3 different) 2882 fps . .

I understand your example but would hate to think Excalibur is utilising that style of advertising. With ammo companies there were always those that overstated loads(weatherby magnum) for example, and those that were pretty darned close and didn't BS too much. Excalibur to me is supposed to be in the latter category, firmly. I mean, did Bill ever need to exaggerate to sell bows the first 20 years? When did he need customers to make excuses for his bows?

[bubba]

Your paying for advertised speed when choosing your bow.... otherwise a 310 or 330 would cost the same as a 380 or 409... people deserve to get what they are paying addiitional $ for when putting out big bucks for more performance.....

just my $.02, for what it's worth.

Gene

Exactly this. I have the 405 but if it shot like a 380 (and I don't care how well it shot) it's going back.
Bubba I am with ya brother.


Brian

Talltines(Brian) A brother from N.J.? Smile anytime Thanks..It's good to see some understand the question asked by 8ptbuk..And not this nonsense Psychological and spiritual Nirvana and voo doo. or kinetic energy, taking cape buffalo,or Strums classic mine is bigger than yours scenario. Hey for you guy's that purchase a M-380 that shoots 355 speeds, and are happy and glad and grin about it,Because it's not about speed, no it's your heightened mystic awareness you have with the bow.... Ok.. That's not me..And i don't need to blow up giant words or need little smiley faces that jump all around. To Express my point of view, Regarding a Question asked.

[strum]

Easy there Bubba we are all friends here and I didnt mean to offend.

[amythntr]

Easy there Bubba we are all friends here and I didnt mean to offend.

x2

Anthony:)

PS: ...much more civil approach if we disagree with a topic Instead of attacking an individual!

[bubba]

Hey, i sure hope we could all be friends, Attacking an individual? not my intention, just a word for word quote from a previous post. Look Boo once P.M ed me over a thread that had become heated, And said bubba it isn't worth it, just let it go, you will be a better man for doing so. Boo? you know the short guy from the Philippines that makes great strings? Well that rings just as true then, as it does now. If i have offended any one i apologize, sincerely. I do get wrapped up to tightly and let my emotions get the better of me at times. So respectfully to all...I'm moving on.

[amythntr]

...it's much harder to apologize than continue to fan a flame... Once done however one feels better and the fire is dead...kudos!

....one thing we can never be accused of and that is not having passion one way or another!

..... Good thing we l don't live in the same community ...

Anthony

[Tom]

This reply is for those that stress over numbers. For all others, pass over this and relax with either a cold or hot drink .

Numbers:
-Everything has a tollerance (+/-) from a set figure, nothing is made to perfection.
-Even the best crono's have a tollerance, meaning their results can vary.
-Arrows, depending on their quality, can preform greatly different from one to another.
-Strings can also alter preformance greatly. Condition of serving, is it waxed, lubed or dry.
-where is the brace height set at & how was that measured at (remember tollerances add)
-The shooter can also effect preformance. If the shooter does not set the stock "tightly" against their sholder, some of the energy will transfer back instead of going only into the arrow.

Your right, none of the above alone would or should effect enough to get to a 15 fps speed loss, but if you add the tollerances (if all were on the - side) I could see that happening.

Now when comparing preformance of bows from different locations there is also different varibles to concider as in wind, temp, humidity, air pressure, and probably most important is the shooter.

In my opinion, there will always be variables which will have an effect on a bows fps. But if this is the only thing you have to worry about (15 fps) then you are a very lucky person.

Enjoy life and only worry about things which need to be worried about.

Tom

[Talltines]

Your paying for advertised speed when choosing your bow.... otherwise a 310 or 330 would cost the same as a 380 or 409... people deserve to get what they are paying addiitional $ for when putting out big bucks for more performance.....

just my $.02, for what it's worth.

Gene

Exactly this. I have the 405 but if it shot like a 380 (and I don't care how well it shot) it's going back.
Bubba I am with ya brother.


Brian

Talltines(Brian) A brother from N.J.? Smile anytime Thanks..It's good to see some understand the question asked by 8ptbuk..And not this nonsense Psychological and spiritual Nirvana and voo doo. or kinetic energy, taking cape buffalo,or Strums classic mine is bigger than yours scenario. Hey for you guy's that purchase a M-380 that shoots 355 speeds, and are happy and glad and grin about it,Because it's not about speed, no it's your heightened mystic awareness you have with the bow.... Ok.. That's not me..And i don't need to blow up giant words or need little smiley faces that jump all around. To Express my point of view, Regarding a Question asked.

Yup truth. Might as well call it the matrix 500 and claim it's the fastest x bow in the world. Because who cares right. Haha. It doesn't matter.

But yes I am moving on. Time to shoot my slow 405. Couldn't resist.

[one shot scott]

Initially I was disappointed in what I was getting out of my 380 when shooting a stock setup. BUT.. I didn't know what it was shooting until recently and in the few years since ive had my bow I have been very happy with it. It shoots great. The bow has held up great and it penetrates every thing it hits with gusto and then some. I cant say that I will never put in a request to get a "hotter" set of limbs but I am happy enough with what I have right now and do not want to go thru the trouble of adjusting everything again. And I do think that there is some truth to the slightly slower ones adding to longevity of limbs. To me that is a reasonable trade off.

And another thing i noticed: Since the chrony, I have found that my speed ring is accurate on my taczone.

I also feel that Excalibur has tried to do their best in reaching the advertised speed and naturally the bows will fluctuate slightly. I just happen to be at the lower end of the scale.

[amythntr]

....after reading the preceeding post by One Shot...I thought if one other benefit that came from attending Boofest and meeting Dr. Danny Miller, Peter ( the Marketing Dude) and Keith (DoeMaster) and that was sincerity... These men live, walk and talk Excalibur

.... What was obvious to me was they sure appear to be very sincere in their discussions about some of the behind the scene workings at Excalibur....

.... They have earned my respect in what they espoused.... They taught me what they are and what Excalibur is all about...

.... They earned my respect such that if I have issues that I need addressed that I will discuss it with them and get it resolved...

.... You know it has been joked around on this forum that everyone should make plans to attend Boofest at least one in their lifetime... The problem is.. It becomes an addiction... And as the commercial goes, "you can't go to just one!"

Anthony

[bubba]

Well the thought of attending a Boo-Fest, For me has been on the top shelve of things i most wanted to do. The opportunity of meeting all those Canadians and Yankees. To be able and sit and walk around putting names to face's and talking Excalibur crossbows and hunting. Out side my family my biggest love's. Truly i have other interests, but they pale in comparison to any thing outdoors. I'm sure it would be a fantastic time. Heck if Upsman can go and return alive. I think i'd be alright...Smile...

[Excalibur Marketing Dude]

Wow, this is a long thread! OK, here's the deal on arrow speeds. Every arrow speed we advertise was achieved by that particular model out of our production line, shooting our minimum arrow weight through our calibrated chronograph. The problem is the list of variables is a mile long. Chronographs can have a 10 fps error +/- right out of the box so, they are not all created equal. I have seen the same crossbow shoot 30 fps faster or slower using different chronographs. How you shoot through the chronograph and the angle you shoot at can also alter the speeds.

Because we hand build every limb through a compression mold they can vary slightly in strength. However, we have been purposely designing our crossbows to shoot faster than advertised to avoid this discussion. We even had a chronograph at last years ATA show to prove to the dealers our crossbows are shooting at or faster than advertised. This is a constant battle. We have no way to test the speed of every crossbow we make but all of our sample tests show they do produce advertised speeds. Can some go faster and some go slower? Yes its possible but, the majority do very close to advertised.

We do realize people pay to get a certain arrow speed number and we do our best to make sure our crossbows do achieve them. But, in the big picture a few FPS faster or slower makes zero difference when it comes to deer hunting.

There is no benefit for us to lie about our arrow speeds and we are not trying to deceive potential customers to give them something less than what they paid for. This makes no sense if you want to stay in business.

If your arrow speed number is really a big concern, send us your limb system and we can test it. However, don't do it this time of year when we are swamped. There is no point to laying up your crossbow during hunting season to achieve a few FPS.

If you need to discuss this further, feel free to call me anytime.

Peter

[xcaliber]

I have one word for Peter's reply,
Outstanding!