Vixen Upgrade or stay put??

Moosehead · Post by **Moosehead** » Fri Jan 23, 2009 4:42 pm

Howdy Excal Hunters

I'm new here and have been reading with interest many informative posts.
I currently have an excal VIXEN with Flemish FF string and use carbon firebolts (eastons?) with 100g Thunderheads. I shot my first archery kill deer this fall (a nice doe) from a GroundMAX groundblind with it. She went 30 yards - cleaner kill than a rifle! Not much of a blood trail though, I hit her a wee bit high. She was just inside of 30yds when I took my shot.

I'm a bit of a perfectionist when it comes to accuracy, and I don't want to sacrifice speed too much with this bow. I have seriously thought of upgrading to a Phoenix, but am wondering if I should bother??? I can easily cock the Vixen and shoot it all day long, and it would be a nice bow to hand off to my kids when they are old enough.

PROBLEM: My pinpoint accuracy disappears outside of 20yd shots. It's still good, but not great. I dont want to sacrifice speed too much, so do I need to switch to a higher FOC and a different broadhead, or change arrows altogether?? I have no tools to measure arrow weight or spin test things - perhaps I need these items or a trip to my local bow shop. I'd like to set up my arrows so I can get better accuracy and good speed.

I had thought of putting some brass inserts in and switching to a 125g slick trick or G-5 Striker broadhead...

Or upgrade to a Phoenix and go with a heavier arrow setup?? I have also seen on this site some modified Vixens with shorter arrows (18.5 inches) and some tricked out risers to gain speed, I'm guessing...

I would REALLY like some input here...

Thanks a lot.

MOOSEHEAD

Normous · Post by **Normous** » Fri Jan 23, 2009 4:51 pm

A lot of people here swear by their Vixen. I really see no need to upgrade. Some arrow tweak might be in order here. First make sure your center your string perfectly every time, if you cock it off center just a little bit your accuracy will suffer. The Thunderhead 100 grouped somwhat OK for me when I tried them. I tried them on various shafts but was still not quite satisfied with their accuracy. The Slick 100 or 125 Mag. gave me the accuracy I needed with my setup. Overall your components sound good.

Leonard Hawkins · Post by **Leonard Hawkins** » Fri Jan 23, 2009 5:20 pm

you did not say if you were using a rope cocker, if not get one and see if accuracy improves. Hawk

Doe Master · Post by **Doe Master** » Fri Jan 23, 2009 5:52 pm

First of all Welcome to the forum Moosehead

Now to your broadhead choice the thunderhead seemed to be a good choice for my compound vertical bow BUT when used on the crossbow it gave less than stellar performance/accuracy .I am but one opinion ,but I have seen people bring bows in they normally are having problems with accuracy using them .
Unfortunately trying different BH is out of the question so I would recommend slick tricks,boltcutters ,or the boss .These BH`s have proven themselves with most members on this forum .

Grizzly Adam · Post by **Grizzly Adam** » Fri Jan 23, 2009 5:58 pm

Welcome, Moosehead!

It's my experience the heavy arrows tend to be more accurate in field conditions ... especially in wind.

As cocking is no problem for me, my preference is a heavy bow with a heavy arrow. The best of all worlds, for me, is a heavy arrow at good speed.

bait pile willie · Post by **bait pile willie** » Fri Jan 23, 2009 6:32 pm

I have a vixen delux.shoot 181/2" gold tip bolts,blazer vanes,125gr stryker broadheads,no prblem with acurracy or resuls if the shot is off its me not my equipment,have taken 7 bears,15 deer 1 coyote with itwon 3 1sts. 1 third in 3-d with it. with my age now it is the perfect bow for me,

DuckHunt · Post by **DuckHunt** » Fri Jan 23, 2009 8:15 pm

Moosehead,

Welcome to the forum.

How is the accuracy with field points? If field points shoot great, then you can rule out the bow as a problem and focus on the arrow/broadhead.

If the accuracy is bad with field points beyond 20 yards, then there are a few things on the bow you can check as well. Consistent cocking? Scope screws tight? All screws tight? Brace height set within specs?

DuckHunt

wabi · Post by **wabi** » Fri Jan 23, 2009 8:17 pm

Welcome!
I think you will find the Vixen has as good, or perhaps even slightly better accuracy than a heavier model.
Before I get blasted for that comment I'd better point out I mean slight! All the Excaliburs are great when it come to accuracy, but the Vixen I had just seemed to be a little better on trigger pull and balance - which equates to an edge on better accuracy than my Exocet or Phoenix. It may have been that I just shot it a lot more, too.
My point is - I don't think a heavier model will offer any better accuracy, and your problem is more likely to be your arrows, not the Excalibur!
I'd recommend doing all preliminary accuracy testing with field points only. Find an arrow and field point weight that gives the accuracy you desire, then try a broadhead of the same weight. I've found several broadheads that group right with field points from my Excalibur, but a lot of broadheads just plain don't shoot well. I just stick with one that gives good accuracy and try it for hunting. When you find a winner, stick with it!

kennisondan · Post by **kennisondan** » Fri Jan 23, 2009 8:48 pm

cheaper foc than new heavier heads is a brass insert in the front for them to screw into and if needed a brass screw at either 20 or 50 grains to screw in the rear of the brass front insert... that should help a lot and you can keep ur investment in the heads u have for the time being... the slicks have the most vocal and numerous followers from my reading on the net forums so far..
dk

warningshot · Post by **warningshot** » Fri Jan 23, 2009 9:21 pm

i have simular issue ...i have a phoenix and wonder if i should move up one to a exocet...i'm sure if i had the exocet ...i would be thinking about the exomax ...there's a guy on the web board that makes an kit to upgrade your bow ....give him a pm to see if he can help you...

Boo · Post by **Boo** » Fri Jan 23, 2009 10:04 pm

In my limited experience it sounds like it needs more FOC, you have poor broadhead alignment, inconsistent arrow speeds or not enough fletching offset.
You can make your own broadhead alignment checking tool with four marbles and a board as per Awshucks.
You can increase FOC by shortening your arrows and or going to a 150 gr Bolt Cutter.
Offset changes are obvious as is checking arrow speeds. Inconsistent arrow speeds can be caused by a string that has not settled in.
It's always interesting to see what fixes what problems so please let us know.

mikej · Post by **mikej** » Fri Jan 23, 2009 10:11 pm

warningshot wrote:i have simular issue ...i have a phoenix and wonder if i should move up one to a exocet...i'm sure if i had the exocet ...i would be thinking about the exomax ...there's a guy on the web board that makes an kit to upgrade your bow ....give him a pm to see if he can help you...

who is it

Moosehead · Post by **Moosehead** » Fri Jan 23, 2009 10:34 pm

Thanks for the warm welcome folks!

OK - After reading the replies so far, I'm convinced that with a few "tweaks", I can get this bow driving tacks at 30+ yards....It already shoots well, I just want it to shoot better!! Using field tips, the bow shoots better than the Thunderheads...

SO - I think the Thunderheads will be retired for the time being - I've been doing some research on this site and a few others - seems like the slick tricks or the G-5 Strikers would be a good fit for my needs. I havent researched the boltcutters, so I'll look into them too.

- Also, I think to go to a higher broadhead weight would be a good idea, along with the brass inserts.

- I like drawing the bow myself, but for accuracy sake, a stringer is a cheap fix that will help, so I will make that change too.

Next question: What will cutting my arrows down to 18.5 inches do?? I realize I will lose a bit of stability, but is the purpose of shortening the arrow for gaining speed? Will I hurt my limbs if I do this?

Am I still going to be shooting fast enough?? By the sounds of it, there are a lot of Vixen fans in here...have any of you modified your bow to increase speed?

Again, many thanks!

Moose

wabi · Post by **wabi** » Fri Jan 23, 2009 10:44 pm

Everyone seems to agree that longer arrows are more accurate.
But...............
I shoot 18.5" arrows in my Phoenix and can't really see any decrease in accuracy.

A 3 shot group @ 25 yards:
(18.5" 2215 aluminum shaft, 2" Blazer vanes, 100gr field points)

awshucks · Post by **awshucks** » Fri Jan 23, 2009 11:24 pm

I had a friend by here w/ a carved tip Vixen w/ claimed accuracy problems. The bow had a Horton multi line scope on it. Put a V-zone on it, shot great for me, he still had accuracy problems. He was hand cocking, I was using a rope cocker. once he used it, no more accuracy problems.

Smokepole Hall has the bow now, [dammit] and is attempting to kill every deer in Tn, lol.

Wabi nailed it, those Vixens are magic!