Got a visit from the Conservation Officer...

[dsr]

I'm beginning to wonder if CO's shouldn't cut us some slack re unloading and casing the firearm.The coyotes in our area are getting pretty bold. They've taken a couple of dogs recently. Down in Nova Scotia they mauled a young lady who died from her experience. We have lots of yotes and it is not unusual to hear them in your vicinity when walking out of the woods after a hunt.I would feel a lot safer with a 00 buckshot loaded than a 12 gauge club. When the CO's go out in the bush late in the day are their weapons unloaded and cased?-----Just a thought.

[DirtyGun]

I don't about the enforement / jusdictional aspects but the retired CO that taught my son's hunter safety and firearms courses in September mentioned that he had recently been talking to his old CO buddies about this subject. They told him they weren't enforcing the gun registry. But that the cops could fine someone something like $4000 if they didn't have their registrations.

We had an issue this past year with a cop entering our range and giving a couple of members a hard time. A lawyer who deals regularly with firearms cases in the courts spoke to this issue at a subsequent club meeting and he assured us that while you must carry your PAL/POL you absolutely are not required by law to carry your individual registration certificates.

I'd rather be safe than sorry, especially when the RCMP has this listed on their web site:

Licence and Registration Requirements
All firearm owners and users need a valid firearms licence and all firearms must be registered. When you are in possession of a firearm, you must be able to show your licence and registration certificate to a peace officer, which may include some wildlife conservation officers, on demand. There is an amnesty until May 16, 2010 which may protect Canadian residents from penalties under the Criminal Code for possessing a non-restricted rifle or shotgun without a valid licence or registration certificate in certain circumstances.
http://www.rcmp-grc.gc.ca/cfp-pcaf/fs-f ... ge-eng.htm

And...

Q. Do I need to carry my licence and registration certificates with me when I take my firearms out hunting?
The Criminal Code states that you must be able to produce a valid licence and registration certificate for the inspection of a peace officer if you have a firearm in your possession. If you do not have these documents with you, the peace officer may seize the firearms. If that was the only reason the firearms were seized, and you can produce the required documents for inspection within 14 days, the police are required to return the firearms to you.
http://www.rcmp-grc.gc.ca/cfp-pcaf/faq/ ... ng.htm#b11

And then, for the official word:

Seizure on failure to produce authorization

117.03 (1) Notwithstanding section 117.02, a peace officer who finds

(a) a person in possession of a firearm who fails, on demand, to produce, for inspection by the peace officer, an authorization or a licence under which the person may lawfully possess the firearm and a registration certificate for the firearm, or

(b) a person in possession of a prohibited weapon, a restricted weapon, a prohibited device or any prohibited ammunition who fails, on demand, to produce, for inspection by the peace officer, an authorization or a licence under which the person may lawfully possess it,

may seize the firearm, prohibited weapon, restricted weapon, prohibited device or prohibited ammunition unless its possession by the person in the circumstances in which it is found is authorized by any provision of this Part, or the person is under the direct and immediate supervision of another person who may lawfully possess it.

Return of seized thing on production of authorization

(2) Where a person from whom any thing is seized pursuant to subsection (1) claims the thing within fourteen days after the seizure and produces for inspection by the peace officer by whom it was seized, or any other peace officer having custody of it,

(a) an authorization or a licence under which the person is lawfully entitled to possess it, and

(b) in the case of a firearm, a registration certificate for the firearm,

the thing shall forthwith be returned to that person.


Due to the amnesty, you can have your firearm returned to you within 14 days if you produce your registration certificate within 14 days after failing to produce your registration certificates at the time of a peace officer requesting them. A peace officer does have the grounds to seize your firearms under 117.03 if you do not produce your registration certificates. However, due to the amnesty, there would be no chance of a conviction.

[Phoenix_Tom]

Further to my previous posts: I was just talking to one of my buddies that was there when the OPP pulled them over with the deer in the back of jeep that had lost the tag. He said the cop never even asked about the registrations or PAL. He was just concerned about the tag and licenses. What sucks here is we all know the law is on the books but we have some law enforcement agencies enforcing the laws and others that have flat out refused. You never know if you're going to be asked for PAL or registrations so why not just carry them to be on the safe side? Besides, you can't buy ammowithout the PAL. Which brings up something I really don't like: anyone can just look at a stores ammo sales registry and see your name, address, and the ammo you purchased. It can give the bad guys a shopping list and a reason to break in to your place.

[DanO]

I notice they lock the book for ammo up with the ammo now, but I could still see some names and addresses at a glance. Many places won't even sell ammo anymore because of the politics and paperwork.

Dan O.

[Phoenix_Tom]

Dan;

it's good if they're starting to lock the books but lots of stores don't. I talk to the managers when they don't.

[TPM]

Due to the amnesty, you can have your firearm returned to you within 14 days if you produce your registration certificate within 14 days after failing to produce your registration certificates at the time of a peace officer requesting them. A peace officer does have the grounds to seize your firearms under 117.03 if you do not produce your registration certificates. However, due to the amnesty, there would be no chance of a conviction.

I agree, you do stand a good chance of facing a temporary seizure of your gun if you fail to produce proper documentation but it has nothing to do with the amnesty. That 14 day rule has always been there and will be long after the amnesty is over.
For what it's worth I also play it safe. To avoid any confusion or conflict I always carry the proper documentation but after the issue we and at our range with an over zealous cop I've become more aware of my rights and how to see to it they are not infringed upon.

[DirtyGun]

Due to the amnesty, you can have your firearm returned to you within 14 days if you produce your registration certificate within 14 days after failing to produce your registration certificates at the time of a peace officer requesting them. A peace officer does have the grounds to seize your firearms under 117.03 if you do not produce your registration certificates. However, due to the amnesty, there would be no chance of a conviction.

I agree, you do stand a good chance of facing a temporary seizure of your gun if you fail to produce proper documentation but it has nothing to do with the amnesty. That 14 day rule has always been there and will be long after the amnesty is over.
For what it's worth I also play it safe. To avoid any confusion or conflict I always carry the proper documentation but after the issue we and at our range with an over zealous cop I've become more aware of my rights and how to see to it they are not infringed upon.

My apologies, I worded that wrong. The amnesty that is currently in place will not enable convictions under the Criminal Code against those who are in possession of an unregistered firearm or are lacking their registration certificates. You must always be in possession of your firearms licence and the current laws state that you must always be in possession of the registration certificate for the firearm you are in possession of, however, the amnesty is not allowing for any convictions regarding lack of a registration certificate. Charges laid in these cases will differ, depending on the circumstances. That's the way the current laws read.

The 14 day seizure is enforceable by any Peace Officer if any firearms owner is unable to produce proper documentation upon request and the firearms owner has the right to claim their firearms within 14 days if they are able to produce the proper documentation, without penalty. This has always been the case in terms of your firearms licence. It is ultimately at the officer's discretion whether or not to seize a firearm due to lacking a registration certificate, mostly due to the Crown's lack of chances at a conviction. Most times the firearm will be seized and the owner is back in possession of it within 14 days, after showing up with the required registration certificate, because most of the time, law abiding firearms owners register their firearms and have the certificates, they just forget to carry them.

Our law enforcement personnel must treat everyone at an equal level and are obligated to enforce the Criminal Code and other documents outlining our laws in this country. If the law reads that the firearm is to be seized, then it gets seized and the owner can sort things out if they have the proper documentation. It's a hassle for the owner, but wouldn't be if they just followed the rules.

[Coffee Break]

I hate Game Wardens! I have been checked or stopped well over a hundred times in my life and the first time was at age 10 or 11 while fishing with another kid the same age. My record is 10 times in 7 day and 8 times was by the same Game Warden. I have never had a violation but have mostly been treated badly. I never talked back and always nice to them. I have had them ruin many days of hunting and fishing.

[gogo]

If you want some interesting reading go on the ontario mnr site, where it says search put in violations. Lots of fines including not having a weapon incased.

[terrym]

One of the guys I own my deer camp with and a close friend is an Ontario game warden. The stories we hear about the dim wits who try every trick in the book to get by the laws and Co's is a joke. Here's a warning for you all. These guys are pro's and have seen every trick in the book. The only thing going for you is that there aren't enough to cover Ontario properly but if they get tipped off by someone which is how alot of charges get laid, you're done for. These guys have more up their sleeves than you would beleive. Thats all I'm gonna give ya.

[dutchhunter]

every time i have been stopped by the warden thy always wait fopr the opp to show up before thy will aproach my truck .thy always have .i waited onbe time for two hours in my truck ith the warden parked behind me with his lights flashing .he said to wait in the truck and to not move untill he said i could .i when to get out of the truck two times to find out what the problem was and he would shout out get back in the truck .finally the oipp pulled up behind us and the two of them caME UP TO THE TRUCK TOGETHER i was just shaking my head .thy checked me all out and every thing was fine i had my orange BEARS coat on and he thought i was out hunting .thy left feeling pretty stupid .but evry time after that thy always wait for the opp to show up DUTCH

[frisky]

I was checked 3 times in my life. 2 times on my own property.