Calling - When to call & how much is too much

[Fatboyxc]

So this is my first year I've tried calling deer. I really nice call from Wabi (sounds great) & a rattle bag. I haven't been real aggressive with the calling yet, but I want to know should I get aggressive now with the rut in full swing. Its been a bit of a tough year, I've got deer in both properties I have permission to hunt but the wind has been terrible for my stand locations.

So what are your thoughts. How much grunting & rattling should I be doing to entice them in range?

Also I still haven't had a shot at deer with my crossbow to date.

[tradshooter]

Welcome to the club. Been calling and a little rattle and the winds suck!!! been a tough go lately. Hope you do better soon.

[wabi]

I usually keep the calling subtle and infrequent unless I have a deer in sight.

When the rut is near or on I get in my stand, give it 15-20 minutes for things to settle down, then a couple soft grunts. Repeat about every 20 minutes unless I see a buck. If I spot one heading my way I remain silent, but if I see one that looks like he's just passing through I'll give him a subtle grunt and watch his reaction. If no reaction I'll give him a louder grunt(s) until he looks my direction.
Sometimes they head my way, sometimes they don't, but it still fun to see one.

[Raymond]

I usually keep the calling subtle and infrequent unless I have a deer in sight.

When the rut is near or on I get in my stand, give it 15-20 minutes for things to settle down, then a couple soft grunts. Repeat about every 20 minutes unless I see a buck. If I spot one heading my way I remain silent, but if I see one that looks like he's just passing through I'll give him a subtle grunt and watch his reaction. If no reaction I'll give him a louder grunt(s) until he looks my direction.
Sometimes they head my way, sometimes they don't, but it still fun to see one.

X2, Dang good advice. Couldn't get any better than that.
Raymond

[korey99]

Bang on with Wabi.

I keep it infrequent when I don't see them too - but more like every 45 minutes for me. And it's game time when I do see one - I grunt the bucks when I see them in the distance, and bleat the does.

Sometimes they react, sometimes they don't.....This season they've been reacting well. It adds another dimension to your hunt...and is really cool when it works!

[Drew]

X4 with Wabi.

I had a buck trotting across the hayfield last Thursday evening at about 200yds. I grunted, got his attention and a few more grunts got him turned and heading my way. Got him 75yds closer before he wandered into the woods again. Thought he would work his way around me but never saw him again. Still, cool to see them react/interact.

[Fatboyxc]

Thanks for all the tips. I plan on putting it to use this week.

[Lake shooter]

Do yourself a favor and learn to do a snort wheeze with your mouth. It's an easy call to do with a little practice and REALLY brings the bucks in! As stated elsewhere, I used this to call in 5 legal bucks last year, 4 closer than 20 yards. The biggest ran across a road to my north, I was facing south. When I turned to see what the commotion was I saw a large buck with a nice rack about 60 yards away. He stopped at the woods edge and I grunted at him. He looked my way but had a destination apparently, and started walking off the way he was headed. Grunted a few times again and same thing. I finally snort wheezed at him the third time he started walking away and he came in pissed, made a scrape not 30 yards out and then came in to about 18 yards looking for another buck to fight! He was BIG, but I didn't take a shot because although large and thick, his rack was ugly and I didn't want it. Hindsight is always 20:20 though!

Called in another nice buck an hour later to the same distance with the same call, didn't want him. Oh yeah, both of these deer ended up downwind of me and the first crossed my walk in path. Both walked away calmly....... Scent control works friends!

On the grunt: yes they work, but it's sporadic at best. In 18 years or so of using many different grunt calls I can say that two bucks most definitely came to the call and a couple others may have. I dare say that if I'd snort wheezed at them I would have had many more in my lap!!!!

[christlike]

Think you can record this snort wheeze somewhere so we can all hear how it sounds?
Thanks

[Lake shooter]

This video has the snort wheeze being made through the call, but you don't need a call. I have two or three different calls that have a snort wheeze feature on them and the only thing they have over doing it by mouth is volume, but realistically, it ain't a loud call. This one sounds pretty real and has good volume. http://www.flambeauoutdoors.com/en/hunt ... ils/MD-518

You can go to YouTube and type in snort wheeze and lots of hits come up. Here's a video of a ten pointer doing it at about 2:30, but you have to listen up..... as I said, it's not a loud call! https://m.youtube.com/watch?v=_3TaYDI1o ... 3TaYDI1ohc

Here's a pretty good article that describes how to do it with your mouth and cupping your hands for direction and volume: http://www.365whitetail.com/whitetail-g ... rt-wheeze/

I cup my hands if I want it to be louder and directed, but often just do it with no directionality so that any buck within 360 degrees has a chance of hearing it. The writer in the article gives some good tips on where and when, but to me that's making things a little more complicated than need be at times. Just like any deer call, they will come to it or not depending on many factors that we may never know and certainly can't control, so when in doubt I call! Simply put, be proactive and you'll see more deer. Be proactive AND really anal about scent control as I am and you'll see a lot more bucks coming from any and all directions! If you don't believe in scent control, the opposite is true as the sunrise.........

[christlike]

Is it the same with white tails as with mule deer?
We only have little bambies here on the island

[Lake shooter]

Have no idea there.

I was thinking about all of this last night and compared it to calling other critters. When I watch huntin' shows, the folks on there make all kinds of different "grunting" sounds with many different calls, and 99% of them don't sound anything like a deer grunt! A buck grunt usually sounds striking similar to a pig, and that's not the sound most calls or callers end up making. Most callers go into a series of grunts with some long, some short and some in between. Yes, deer may do that on occasion but that's not what I hear in the woods and on TV or on YouTube videos. The doe grunts that I've heard in the wild have been maybe 2-3 seconds and a little higher pitched with no inflection, or change in tone or pitch. I called a doe in once doing that exact call but couldn't get a shot. She lost interest and turned to leave and I did the same thing again. She instantly stopped and looked back, then came back in and this time gave me a shot. Dead doe!!!

I mentioned the other critters because I believe this to be a similar human phenomenon of calling how THEY want to here it, with very often not much in common with what animals really do! Ever watch or listen to a turkey, duck or pig calling contest? Ever heard these same critters do much of that crap in the wild? It may impress the judges, but what about the animal you're trying to call?
Kind of like fishing lures and baits; most catch way more fisherman than fish!

My point here is that keeping things on the conservative side is probably a good thing, a darn good bit of the time! Also, I hope none of y'all take this as me preaching or chastising anyone, because I've been guilty myself more than a few times! The ONLY deer that ever came literally running in to one of my grunt calls was maybe 8 years ago, and the call was what I would describe as a 2 second pig grunt. Can't tell you what it was because it came busting out of a bedding thicket and took the easiest route out of there, around to my left. It went from a full run to dead stop about 20 yards away, but I could only see it's front feet and lower legs as the head and body were obscured by bushes and limbs. My hunch is that it was a buck that was ready to fight just from the suddenness of it all, but after standing there looking for that other buck for maybe two minutes it walked back out with me never seeing anymore.

Something else that was reinforced from Bill Winke who does "Midwest Whitetail", IMHO the best show there is on deer hunting strategies and tactics. Bill actually did a show last year on when to call, and the major point was NOT to call as long as the deer was committed and coming your way or stopped and looking for that other deer. He showed a few videos of this in action, with bucks looking for the other deer but already confirming with their eyes that nothing was there. These deer either left spooked or just left.

On the other hand, deer that had come in to some original calling but then lost interest were allowed to turn and walk away a fairly good distance (but still within earshot) before another call was made. These deer were far enough away that they just may have thought that the "other" deer had returned, and they came back in, just as my doe did years ago.

[sipsey]

Here's an article from a fellow who claims to be close to an expert. See what you think.

Cy "GruntMan" Weichert Playing the "Death Curl"


Whitetails are creatures of habit, and so are hunters. Deer that practice poor habits, such as coming in to a hunters call without the wind in their favor, usually end up in freezers. Hunters that practice poor habits, like calling from an improper setup, usually end up looking at the white flag of regret waving goodbye, as that buck of a lifetime saunters out of sight! I have been calling bucks into bow range for the past 30 years, and have perfected the art of mouth-calling to the point where I don't ever believe that there's a buck out there that I can't get to come to my calls.


Over the past 3 decades all but one of the bucks I have arrowed have been called in. It's a passion of mine, and through much trial and error (mostly error) I have learned that the absolute most important aspect of calling bucks successfully lies completely in your setup.

Modern day grunt calls sound realistic enough to fool a buck's ear. Knight and Hale's Da'Bone is my favorite, and the one I keep in my pack for when my throat is sore or I have a cold and can't mouth call. There's a vast difference, though, from calling in bucks, and actually calling one in to a position where you can successfully harvest one with a bow. In fact, I'd argue its only 10% about making the right sounds......and 90% about setting up in a position that will enable you to get him in close, and then get a shot.

When choosing a place to setup and call from, you need to always use is to conceal yourself using the terrain. By "concealing yourself" I don't mean hiding yourself. Rather, I mean setting up in a place where the ground is higher in elevation, or obstructed by a hedgerow or brush from the main route of travel of the bucks I am calling. This makes the buck want to move your way to get a look at the other buck in his turf. If a buck can clearly see as far as you are calling from, then he can see there's not a deer there. Bucks that live past their second season have likely been called at before, and are wary enough to be reluctant to move your way without a second sense of confirmation. If you set up on a bench above him, or beyond a brush line, his curiosity will usually mount, and he'll close in at least enough to get a visual. The exception to this, and great tactic to give visual confirmation is use of a decoy. In this case, bucks eyesight can be used to fool them into charging in for a doe or to run off the less dominant buck decoy.

Most deer, and especially older bucks, tend to trust their sense of smell far more than they do their ears. As a result, one habit that most if not all older, dominant bucks will stay true to is one I call "The Death Curl"...that is, they will always curl downwind of your location when coming into a call to get a nasal assurance of what they heard. I named this the Death Curl about ten years ago after getting foiled by a monster buck. I had called at him across a goldenrod field, and rather than pass directly in front of me in the open, upwind where I planned to shoot, he cut behind me, downwind in the cover of a dense spruce stand. At 5 yards from my tree, he got my wind and busted out, never to be seen again. Every hunt thereafter, I plan for that to happen, and have started to set up with my stand facing to the downwind side, expecting that as the norm, and made sure I have a clear shooting lane just before the buck hits my ScentCone.

The next hunt, and every hunt thereafter, when I call to a mature buck, I am in position to shoot exactly in the place that most hunters would not be, and the results are astonishing. In the past 7 seasons, I have harvested 5 mature bucks, all of which have circled downwind at 25 or 30 yards, right into my planned shooting lane. It's become the bucks' last move before I turn my arrow loose, and it works so well that I've named it the death curl.

Understanding bucks habits will always help you be in the right position, and there's nothing worse than becoming part of the statistical mass that returns to camp reporting to have seen that bruiser buck, and not getting a shot. Play the "death curl" every time you plan to call for whitetails, and you'll be amazed how often it works!


Sent from my iPad

[Lake shooter]

Most of the rattling gurus that I've read or seen on TV pretty much say the same thing. Some of them go an extra step of purposely setting up with fairly open ground downwind to try and keep a circling buck from being comfortable going that far, in hopes of bringing them in earlier.

I'm no guru on anything, but the one that I rattled in and shot 8 days ago came in from directly upwind, stopped directly upwind and then walked crosswind to his demise. And this wasn't a tinhorn first, second or third season buck. As I said before, deer don't always do anything!

[Zap]

If you rattle and/or call right at sunset you stand a good chance of educating a buck that you have not seen when you leave.