FOC Broadhead

[sagedoc]

Any thoughts on trying this broadhead using the firebolt shafts that I shoot with my equinox? Is that enough power to make them work properly?

[nchunterkw]

Just from the number crunching I've done on here.....

An Equinox should push a 400gr arrow around 340fps and a 450gr arrow around 330fps. The 450gr arrow gives you a momentum of 0.65. I would think that would be good for an FOC. As for the Firebolt shafts, I think they would be fine but they are just not my favorite. I am partial to the Black Eagle Zombies because they are so stiff. Others on here would know more

[vixenmaster]

I shot this Doe who was full alert n lookin straight at me. Didn't move, got nailed DRT, neck shot 20 yds or so. Used a 2" Swhacker was not a pass-through but it did heavy damage to her spine n artery as it entered. Excal carved tip limbs. One thing that ppl. should knowed is it pays to know the body of a deer n where you can & cannot shoot. I will shoot one thuru the shoulders in a heart beat. I have lost one deer usin a Bow in the 52 yrs i have hunted them, i have lost 2 to a shotgun n buckshot in the 52 yrs. Lost 1deer to a rifle in the 52 yrs. That was a botched trackin jobon my part when i was young.

[SEW]

Mike,
That bow record of only 1 loss is likely unmatched. People would do well to see what you shoot and how you do it.
For those of you don't know Mike, I'd take him at his word!

[MDM44]

Data on " How far a deer travels after the shot" is very interesting. On the Muzzys I will agree. I had used them (100gr 3 blade ) for years in compounds. Could count non-pass thrus on one hand, but recoveries were normally 70-90 yards on good shots. Of 4 non pass thrus 1 was very light arrow ( never used them again ) 2 DRT, down thru spine out the chest, almost straight down. And 1 quartering away out the opposite shoulder almost came out. For the crossbow I will be looking for a new broadhead this year.

[MDM44]

Just posted a new " short arrow " update, the F.O.C. may perform VERY well with this set-up. Sounds like the 390 gr. arrow with high front of center should blow this big head thru nicely.

[tremps01]

Hey Sew , how do you distribute the weight to obtain 406 gr.?
Did you use lighted nock?

Marcel

[SEW]

Hey Sew , how do you distribute the weight to obtain 406 gr.?
Did you use lighted nock?

Marcel

I'd had Big John made 18" Zombies, plastic moon nocks, AL inserts, Blazers - 396g. Southshore - 18" Zombies, plastic flat nocks, Blazers, AL inserts - 406gs. Why the difference? Don't know.

[flightattendant100]

Mike,
That bow record of only 1 loss is likely unmatched. People would do well to see what you shoot and how you do it.
For those of you don't know Mike, I'd take him at his word!

He stacks those "tick toters" deep every year. That is an amazing record, Mike. Congrats.

[Walkin]

When you(SEW) said:
"However, there is a big difference in the inflight and terminal performance of the various expandibles. I'm consumed with ballistic matters:"
I took note.

I agree with that, and that is why the data that you provide cannot tell the story of how a broad head will perform-it's a hunting point not a target point. Unless the shot is guaranteed to be a certain distance and angle, how can one know what the broad head must do at at what distance.

Arrows slow down quite a bit, I see the chronograph/momentum information for point blank shots but what going on at 50 yd? 70 yd? Especially with the super spin helical fletch that are popular; arrows meet resistance in the air like a bullet does; I think some correlation along those lines would be wise to take into consideration. Heavy arrows(500 or 600 grain) would still have much more energy at long distance to operate a large cutter that is minimally swept back.

Tiny 7/8" fixed broad heads have brought down full sized elk.

My point is that in hunting, at least the hunting I've done, the scenario to prepare for is no particular scenario at all; and for that task I think that the setup that gives the best range of performance wins out, whether you choose a tiny mechanical or a huge albatross spreading its wings.

Joe

[vixenmaster]

When you(SEW) said:
"However, there is a big difference in the inflight and terminal performance of the various expandibles. I'm consumed with ballistic matters:"
I took note.

I agree with that, and that is why the data that you provide cannot tell the story of how a broad head will perform-it's a hunting point not a target point. Unless the shot is guaranteed to be a certain distance and angle, how can one know what the broad head must do at at what distance.

Arrows slow down quite a bit, I see the chronograph/momentum information for point blank shots but what going on at 50 yd? 70 yd? Especially with the super spin helical fletch that are popular; arrows meet resistance in the air like a bullet does; I think some correlation along those lines would be wise to take into consideration. Heavy arrows(500 or 600 grain) would still have much more energy at long distance to operate a large cutter that is minimally swept back.

Tiny 7/8" fixed broad heads have brought down full sized elk.

My point is that in hunting, at least the hunting I've done, the scenario to prepare for is no particular scenario at all; and for that task I think that the setup that gives the best range of performance wins out, whether you choose a tiny mechanical or a huge albatross spreading its wings.

Joe

We can compile 5 million BH & arrow kills & none are the same. Unless its a fluke there will never be two exactly the same. Its all about you & yer equipment

[njlungbuster]

Has anyone tried using the FOC 170's with the factory quill arrows that come with the Micro 335? I'm currently shooting my factory quills with flat ignitor nocks and 125gr NAP Spitfires.

[nchunterkw]

When you(SEW) said:
"However, there is a big difference in the inflight and terminal performance of the various expandibles. I'm consumed with ballistic matters:"
I took note.

I agree with that, and that is why the data that you provide cannot tell the story of how a broad head will perform-it's a hunting point not a target point. Unless the shot is guaranteed to be a certain distance and angle, how can one know what the broad head must do at at what distance.

Arrows slow down quite a bit, I see the chronograph/momentum information for point blank shots but what going on at 50 yd? 70 yd? Especially with the super spin helical fletch that are popular; arrows meet resistance in the air like a bullet does; I think some correlation along those lines would be wise to take into consideration. Heavy arrows(500 or 600 grain) would still have much more energy at long distance to operate a large cutter that is minimally swept back.

Tiny 7/8" fixed broad heads have brought down full sized elk.

My point is that in hunting, at least the hunting I've done, the scenario to prepare for is no particular scenario at all; and for that task I think that the setup that gives the best range of performance wins out, whether you choose a tiny mechanical or a huge albatross spreading its wings.

Joe

We can compile 5 million BH & arrow kills & none are the same. Unless its a fluke there will never be two exactly the same. Its all about you & yer equipment

My view is to try to have a pass through on every shot. That is how an arrow/BH can do the most damage. So my comments are generally bent in that direction. And I try to setup arrows that will achieve that goal at MY maximum range. That is the scenario I think one should prepare for. And to do that adequately you have to understand your equipment and it's capabilities and limitations, and your own abilities.
It's no lie that mechanical heads bleed energy out of an arrow much quicker than a fixed head (mostly from the energy it takes to open them) so if you are to use one you need to make sure you have enough energy to do the job. And to Walkin's point, different shots require different energy. It's one thing to pass a 3" head through some ribs, and quite another to pass it through a shoulder blade.
Now with a 380 , or 405 I don't think you have to think too much about this as those bows have so much power, but as you get down in power (305, 330 type bows) I think you need to think about and understand what it will take to have that head perform as designed all the way through a deer.
However it's great that this head is out there AND that it flies well out of a 405, because the faster the arrow goes, the harder it is to get it to fly right. So mechanicals help a great deal in that regard. Most likely if I owned either of those bows, these BHs would sit atop my arrows. As it is, I will most likely mess around with some this summer.

[vixenmaster]

Good post above mine here. Thats correct & jus because the BH/arrow shoots well from yer models doesn't it will have the required energy to make a pass-through on yer game. Thats where momentum n arrow weight, plus fps/poundage of crossbow come into effect

[lagarman]

SEW and nchunterkw, Every time I see one of your posts, I know it's going to be informative w/ facts and/or opinion based on personal experience/ research. I really respect that and just wanted to thank you for sharing this type of info. While I have many years w/ a compound bow, this xbow world is a completely different animal.

I don't have my 380 yet (still busy ice fishing), but the FOC looks quite impressive, especially when used w/ the 380/405. I am fortunate, like SEW, I can walk out my door and hunt, but I need them to drop quickly, so they don't go onto a neighboring property. I feel this BH gives me the best chance of making that happen.

Heading to the PA Great American Outdoor Show in a couple weeks and hope to make a decision on a scope. Then it will be time to place an order.....very excited to get started!

BTW, Avatar is a recent pic of a 2.5 year old 9 point seen out my home window. Letting him grow up a bit more. He should be a beauty this season and I hope I get a chance at him w/ the 380!!