Hunting range with 300-310fps velocities?

[MickB]

Hi guys just wondering if I bought an xbow set up for actual velocities of 310fps, what is the maximum useful range? I am trying to talk myself into getting something like a matrix 330 rather than a matrix 380. But I would like to shoot some things out to 50 yards or so. Unrealistic with the lighter bow and standard scope setup?

[Sparkey]

Irregardless of if it shoots 400fps, 380, 310 or 275, I don't take shots outside of 30 yards and personally try to keep them at 20 yards or less.

We are not talking .270 150gr rifled slugs traveling at 2600 feet per second. Too much can happen when an arrow is traveling to take long shots, but I am sure others would disagree.

[MickB]

I was going to add to my post please answer only if you do shoot to 50 yards, to save this being derailed to a another topic. Its a trajectory comparison question, thanks if it could be viewed as such.

[Possum]

I posted this some time ago but maybe this will help:
I was shooting my Matrix 330 with a Single Stage TT Trigger, a naked 36 strand 8190 flemish string with 7" .036 Angel Majesty serving. Brace Height was 11/16" from the riser and has Dan Miller Bumpers. the arrow was a 18" Gold Tip Lazer II Pro series with 110 gr. brass insert, 20 gr. aluminum flat nock, and testing was done with both 100 gr. f/p and 125 gr. f/p. Arrow weight with the 100 gr. f/p was 383.4 with a FOC of 22%, and weight with the 125 f/p was 409.3 with a FOC of 23.9%. Testing was done from 10 to 60 yards from a rest. (I was hitting inside a 2 1/2" circle every time at 60 yards. (Not bragging, just impressed with Excalibur and the bow itself.)
I set my chrony 20" in front of my target and placed a 3/16" steel plate in front of the chrony for protection.
Initial velocity with the 100 gr. f/p was 322 fps. and with the 125gr. f/p 319 fps.
Here is what I came up with:

100gr. f/p FPS -- KE _________________ 125gr. f/p FPS -- KE

10 yds**** 305 -- 79 __________________________ 302 -- 83
20 yds**** 288 -- 71 __________________________ 286 -- 74
30 yds**** 273 -- 63 __________________________ 271 -- 66
40 yds**** 258 -- 57 __________________________ 256 -- 60
50 yds**** 245 -- 51 __________________________ 242 -- 53
60 yds**** 232 -- 46 __________________________ 229 -- 48

One arrow was completely obliterated on the steel plate due to my error (I wasn't paying attention and used the 20 yard crosshair when I shot at 50 yards.)
Velocity, kinetic energy and momentum drop off immediatly and continues to fall at a steady rate with my setup. While my setup is capable of cleanly killing deer size animals and smaller out to 60 yards just too many thinks can happen in the time it takes my arrow to reach it's mark. I do practice out to 60 yards but my self imposed personal limit for shooting at live animals is inside forty. In 36 years of hunting with recurve, compounds and crossbows, I have never took a shot over 25 yards.

[NEPAbowhunter]

In my opinion I think you are just handicapping yourself with the 330 if you are going to shot at live animals out to fifty yards. I would want the extra horsepower.

[Boo]

Keep in mind the OP's home is in Oz, so he's not shooting at twitchy whitetails.
I would not shoot at a whitetail at 50 with your set up, but after killing a deer at 38 yards with a 165 Exocet, I would say that, if you can read your animal and assuming the reflex of your quarry is not that of a whitetail, you won't have an issue with an arrow traveling 310 ft/sec.
A big part of range has to do with the intended target. To put thus into perspective, it you were to be hunting a 3 toed sloth, your max range could be 100 yards. A whitetail that came to a call and is looking for you, the caller, I would say less than 30 yards ultra max. Of course all this depends on just how hungry you are

[L. E. Carroll]

If the " things you want to shoot " at 50 yards are large animals which you have respect for ?

IMO, Err on the side of trajectory and performance and go with at least a Matrix or Micro 355..... better yet would be the 380.

Gene
( look below and see what I'm using...yes, my Micro falls into your 310 fps catagory at the range you mentioned also, and I personally feel it's effective range for me, up to and possibly including elk is right at 30 yards. )

[Predator55]

If you look at bestcrossbowsource they have a chart that states shooting 305fps, at fifty yards has 72/73 ft lbs of KE. Which is plenty for any NA game. Now, does that mean you'll get a deer to stand still for the shot? who knows, but, it will certainly kill at the range.

[sproulman]

Irregardless of if it shoots 400fps, 380, 310 or 275, I don't take shots outside of 30 yards and personally try to keep them at 20 yards or less.

We are not talking .270 150gr rifled slugs traveling at 2600 feet per second. Too much can happen when an arrow is traveling to take long shots, but I am sure others would disagree.

Go to front of class you would not believe the number of bears wounded here in my area with 50 yd shots ...If I was taking shots at 50 yards I would want fix point even tho it may not fly as good as expanding point..Friends I hope you all reduce your hunting yards I know some need long shot because of open area hunting but wounding a buck is not something we want to do...Thanks..

[longbow joe]

After all my years of longbow n recurve hunting my 330 feels like a rocket launcher ....but i wont shoot over 40 yards at a buck just not right for me i can get 3 inch groups with my 330 at 50 yards but wont do it on a buck at the risk of him making a move .then the guilt trip from wounding him. ......been there did that.

[DuckHunt]

I set my chrony 20" in front of my target and placed a 3/16" steel plate in front of the chrony for protection.
Initial velocity with the 100 gr. f/p was 322 fps. and with the 125gr. f/p 319 fps.
Here is what I came up with:

100gr. f/p FPS -- KE _________________ 125gr. f/p FPS -- KE

10 yds**** 305 -- 79 __________________________ 302 -- 83
20 yds**** 288 -- 71 __________________________ 286 -- 74
30 yds**** 273 -- 63 __________________________ 271 -- 66
40 yds**** 258 -- 57 __________________________ 256 -- 60
50 yds**** 245 -- 51 __________________________ 242 -- 53
60 yds**** 232 -- 46 __________________________ 229 -- 48

Possum,
That is some very interesting data you have there. You show a huge drop off in speed compared to what I have seen on some ballistic calculators. I trust your data because you measured the actual speed at the target instead of calculating it. The calculator at: http://www.bestcrossbowsource.com/cross ... calculator says your arrow with a 100gr head (383.4gr total) should still be going 303fps at 60 yards. Your real world speed is more than 80fps slower that what their calculator is predicting. I wonder why there is such a huge discrepancy. Could an aggressive helical fletch instead of straight or offset fletch cause that much of a difference? I wonder if the the impact of an aggressive fletch could be like a flu-flu arrow? I'm scratching my head on this one. I'm sure someone has tested the impact on speed for the different types.

DuckHunt

[MickB]

Thanks guys for the replies. More speed might be a better idea then.
Being in oz the game is hogs, goats and possibly some donkeys and wild cattle if I get lucky. Nothing with great reflexes I don't think These are all pests in plague proportions and outcompete or eat our native animals. I'll take any shot I think will work.

Regards the above velocities of the tests, that is very interesting. From a rifle background all I can think is the manufacturers are maybe calculating a theoretical ballistic coefficient for the arrows based purely off modelling the dimensions and form factor( nose shape).In reality other factors such as the arrow minutely flexing, wobbling and generally not flying as the perfect mathematic object are drastically effecting the BC? Bullet manufacturers also fudge their figures a bit, but not as badly as the data above indicates arrow makers do. That is a major surprise, thanks for outlining it.

[Possum]

I set my chrony 20" in front of my target and placed a 3/16" steel plate in front of the chrony for protection.
Initial velocity with the 100 gr. f/p was 322 fps. and with the 125gr. f/p 319 fps.
Here is what I came up with:

100gr. f/p FPS -- KE _________________ 125gr. f/p FPS -- KE

10 yds**** 305 -- 79 __________________________ 302 -- 83
20 yds**** 288 -- 71 __________________________ 286 -- 74
30 yds**** 273 -- 63 __________________________ 271 -- 66
40 yds**** 258 -- 57 __________________________ 256 -- 60
50 yds**** 245 -- 51 __________________________ 242 -- 53
60 yds**** 232 -- 46 __________________________ 229 -- 48

Possum,
That is some very interesting data you have there. You show a huge drop off in speed compared to what I have seen on some ballistic calculators. I trust your data because you measured the actual speed at the target instead of calculating it. The calculator at: http://www.bestcrossbowsource.com/cross ... calculator says your arrow with a 100gr head (383.4gr total) should still be going 303fps at 60 yards. Your real world speed is more than 80fps slower that what their calculator is predicting. I wonder why there is such a huge discrepancy. Could an aggressive helical fletch instead of straight or offset fletch cause that much of a difference? I wonder if the the impact of an aggressive fletch could be like a flu-flu arrow? I'm scratching my head on this one. I'm sure someone has tested the impact on speed for the different types.

DuckHunt

Duckhunt, I was a little surprised at the loss of speed too but i just had to know for sure. I have archery ballistics software installed on one of my older Computers that I use to calculate these things including graphing out an arrow's trajectory. Using this software the calculated speed was a little generous compared to the actual speed (my chronograph is accurate). After I get my 350LE set up my way I will break out the chrono and steel plate for more testing and will test a straight fletched arrow just to see, but i am sure the loss of speed will be less. The arrow that i was shooting was fletched with an EZ fletch bolt and 2" blazers so it did have a lot of helical. I would like to check the speeds on a crossbow shooting an initial velocity of more than 400 fps but i don't have one of those and I don't know any around here that has one. I would think that if a person wanted an arrow to be traveling at or near 300 fps to 310 fps 50 yards down range, they would need to be launching an arrow with an actual initial velocity of over 400 fps.

[MickB]

My post related to 300-310fps at the firing end, not downrange. The figures were to take into account slightly heaiver 375-400 grain arrows out of the 330fps rated bow.

[papabear1]

Irregardless of if it shoots 400fps, 380, 310 or 275, I don't take shots outside of 30 yards and personally try to keep them at 20 yards or less.

We are not talking .270 150gr rifled slugs traveling at 2600 feet per second. Too much can happen when an arrow is traveling to take long shots, but I am sure others would disagree.

X2, 20 yds. is my sweet spot !!!!!