Making a monster ?

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LongCarbine
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Making a monster ?

Post by LongCarbine » Sat Feb 16, 2019 11:30 am

Hey guys . I'm looking at doing something , Not sure if I should. I have an alum. rail Axiom and a Matrix 355 . It looks like if I milled a slot in the Axiom's rail and drilled & tapped 2 holes for the stock ( looks like the trigger units can just be switched ) I'm a machinist by trade so that's no problem . But I think the 2 1/2" in extra pull length is WAY to much . I think the 380 is only like 7/8" longer than my 355. The reasons I'm thinking about this are I would like a very flat shooting bow (410 grain arrows) for mule deer hunting . And the short little Axiom would make a sweet shooting bow for the grand kids . And lastly I"m bored with winter already !!! Please feel free to tell me that I'm crazy . ANY input would be helpful .
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Normous
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Re: Making a monster ?

Post by Normous » Sat Feb 16, 2019 1:03 pm

I am not a machinist by trade (I build Engines) but I have modified two mainframes, by cutting down and drilling new Mainframe to Riser holes using simple home tools and a good measuring tape.

With your skill set and access to a machine shop armed with accurate measurements and mills, your wish is easy to fill on a slow day at the office.
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LongCarbine
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Re: Making a monster ?

Post by LongCarbine » Sat Feb 16, 2019 2:11 pm

Normous wrote:
Sat Feb 16, 2019 1:03 pm
With your skill set and access to a machine shop armed with accurate measurements and mills, your wish is easy to fill on a slow day at the office.
What would be your best guess be a 410 - 415 maybe ?
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Normous
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Re: Making a monster ?

Post by Normous » Sat Feb 16, 2019 2:30 pm

I would keep the 405 mainframe length dimension.
EXCALFFLICTION Since 1991 ->>-----------> 2019
Kustom Krug Micro 355 and Matrix 355
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LongCarbine
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Re: Making a monster ?

Post by LongCarbine » Sat Feb 16, 2019 2:54 pm

That's what I was afraid of . I really didn't want to cut back the frame just in case I wanted to go back with both bows. I wish I could buy a piece of main frame with no holes or slots then I would be in business !
Thanks
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nchunter
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Re: Making a monster ?

Post by nchunter » Sat Feb 16, 2019 3:04 pm

If you do it, wear safety glasses while shooting it—or better yet, a face mask.

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janesy
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Re: Making a monster ?

Post by janesy » Sat Feb 16, 2019 3:21 pm

LongCarbine wrote:
Sat Feb 16, 2019 2:54 pm
That's what I was afraid of . I really didn't want to cut back the frame just in case I wanted to go back with both bows. I wish I could buy a piece of main frame with no holes or slots then I would be in business !
Thanks
Mainframes are available. Post up a wanted add.

Or for what's it worth, watch the local rags. A couple months ago there was an older bow in Kitchener for $125. It would have been a perfect doner.
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shafferm
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Re: Making a monster ?

Post by shafferm » Sat Feb 16, 2019 3:44 pm

The power stroke on the axiom is listed as being 14.5 inches, if you were to mount up a matrix riser and limbs and pull them back that far you would likely be somewhere around a 325 pound draw weight and somewhere around 440 fps as an estimate. The BD440 is only showing a max of 300 pounds and the limbs used on it are slightly different /thicker at the base than the limbs currently on your 355. The slight limb change is likely what is getting them to 440 fps at only around 300 pounds peak weight. The hole pattern on the matrix and axiom risers are also slightly different so you would also need to address the riser hole spacing. There may be some concerns related to the max draw weight that your existing trigger assembly can handle as well. I would not recommend going beyond what the 405 had for a power stroke, there is some margin beyond that length for what the components can handle, although you are getting outside of what they were originally designed to handle. I do recall that a couple of Vixen rails have been modified as they had a 14" power stroke to run a matrix riser and limbs and were a bit hotter than a 405.

I did put together a combination bow that started life as a point blanc with its 11.8" power stroke and added a micro riser that I remachined to go from using a single bolt to the two bolts of the longer limbed point blanc. I then installed matrix limbs on the modified riser. It will shoot just a bit over 300 fps with the matrix limbs and it can be swapped back to original point blanc specs by changing out the two riser and limb combos. This is a very fun combination and takes advantage of the overlap in power stroke between the matrix limbs and the older point blanc. I swapped out the stock for an Exomax stock that I had modified the cheekpiece to adjust up and down and actually used that bow at Boofest last year. The bow can still be reconfigured back into a target bow pretty rapidly.

Here is the data that I used to model the longer power stroke/weights/speeds.

405 13.8 290
380 13.1 260
355 12.2 240
330 11.4 220
310 10.9 200
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papa bear1
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Re: Making a monster ?

Post by papa bear1 » Sat Feb 16, 2019 4:57 pm

ok, you are crazy :lol: :wink:

Dave :thumbup:
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flightattendant100
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Re: Making a monster ?

Post by flightattendant100 » Sat Feb 16, 2019 6:41 pm

Danny Miller told me a while back, about his first run at making a Matrix. He modded an Exo series riser and used. Phoenix rail ( I think same length as your Axiom) He told me he cocked it the first time and knew one of two things was going to blow up. Either the limbs or his back! That’s when he started trying shorter rails. Lot better story when Danny tells it😎

LongCarbine
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Re: Making a monster ?

Post by LongCarbine » Sun Feb 17, 2019 8:38 am

Thanks for the replies guys. You all confirmed it would be too much without cutting down . I'll be on the look out for an old rail .
Again thanks. Jim
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flightattendant100
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Re: Making a monster ?

Post by flightattendant100 » Sun Feb 17, 2019 8:52 am

LongCarbine wrote:
Sun Feb 17, 2019 8:38 am
Thanks for the replies guys. You all confirmed it would be too much without cutting down . I'll be on the look out for an old rail .
Again thanks. Jim
When I made my "Poor Mans Magnum" Excal. I used a rail from a Vixen II. It is half way between a 380 and a 405 in draw length. Shoots plenty fast and is about all that I want to cock.

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janesy
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Re: Making a monster ?

Post by janesy » Sun Feb 17, 2019 9:17 am

I agree above. If you are machining. Matching to the "micro" riser spec. Single mounting.
That would open up so many options for down the road. You'd never be bored again :D
Micro-Hybrid-bulldog "PitBull370"
MOBU Micro BD345 "Greener"
Xtra Micro BD310 "Small-Fry"
Micro Axe MOBU.

Every little sound in the bush sounds like footsteps... Until you hear footsteps!

otisbrazwell
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Re: Making a monster ?

Post by otisbrazwell » Sun Feb 17, 2019 12:10 pm

janesy wrote:
Sun Feb 17, 2019 9:17 am
I agree above. If you are machining. Matching to the "micro" riser spec. Single mounting.
That would open up so many options for down the road. You'd never be bored again :D
is that a hint that the 440 riser bolts the same?

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janesy
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Re: Making a monster ?

Post by janesy » Sun Feb 17, 2019 12:50 pm

otisbrazwell wrote:
Sun Feb 17, 2019 12:10 pm
janesy wrote:
Sun Feb 17, 2019 9:17 am
I agree above. If you are machining. Matching to the "micro" riser spec. Single mounting.
That would open up so many options for down the road. You'd never be bored again :D
is that a hint that the 440 riser bolts the same?
Aside for the angle, which we could not measure, so I don't know. The riser is the same. That is now, "the riser". Used on most models not "take down"
Now, it does have a rubber gasket in between it and the rail. So I cannot say for certain wether the rail was machined or the riser to incorporate the gasket. Or possibly not at all.

If I had to guess, and it's simply that. The additional FPS is all coming from the new limbs.
Micro-Hybrid-bulldog "PitBull370"
MOBU Micro BD345 "Greener"
Xtra Micro BD310 "Small-Fry"
Micro Axe MOBU.

Every little sound in the bush sounds like footsteps... Until you hear footsteps!

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