Hogs in Ontario?

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Carnivorous
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Re: Hogs in Ontario?

Post by Carnivorous » Thu May 16, 2019 2:12 pm

I find it odd that with hundreds of Trail cams setup in Ontario you would think people would post them on hunting forums.. Lol
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Fazan
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Re: Hogs in Ontario?

Post by Fazan » Thu May 16, 2019 3:13 pm

Hi5 wrote:
Thu May 16, 2019 1:12 pm
Laws will vary by jurisdiction.

Those piggies SHOULDN'T be defined as "wildlife", because they aren't-- any more than if an African lion were prowling your back yard. Still, your provincial law may be worded differently, so they might get included as wildlife. There again, all hunting after sundown, or with the aid of lights, might be illegal, no matter the subject of your hunting.

That prohibition USUALLY applies only to wildlife, however. So it depends on what is "wildlife".

If a farmer wants to shoot and butcher his steer after dark and with the benefit of artificial lighting, that shouldn't be any business of the state. But, who knows.....
They look pretty wild to me. And they were brought to this continent as wild animals, not as pets or zoo attraction.
But who am I to judge. Authorities should do that for all of us. In my opinion driving 130 km on 400 series highways is perfectly safe (in good weather conditions), but authorities say no and if you do it the way you think and get caught you pay the fine. Because you disobeyed the rules set by the authorities. How do I know if I obey or disobey the rules regarding wild boar (or feral pig) hunting if there is no place I can check what those rules are? Or if they exist at all?

"Laws will vary by jurisdiction"
That's right. "Jurisdiction" in hunting regulations is WMU, or if MNR feels there could be other jurisdictions affecting your hunt they advise you to check your municipal laws or buylaws. But that is most of time related to firearms and Sunday hunting, rather than animals, with exception of migratory birds which is jurisdiction of federal government.

As for what farmer can or cannot do with HIS farm animals that doesn't fall into hunting regulations. Regulated different way I'm sure.

Just my 2 cents

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IronNoggin
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Re: Hogs in Ontario?

Post by IronNoggin » Thu May 16, 2019 4:40 pm

The amount / numbers have been blown more than a little out of proportion by these researchers.
Of course, it is in their interest to maintain their study funding, and that only occurs as the problem "escalates".

My Lady & I have friends and relatives living in most of the areas in question in Saskatchewan.
And a great many of those (most) are ranchers & farmers.
They tell a slightly different tale regarding the numbers out there.
I tend to believe those on the ground over any university based "researcher".

Just Sayin'... :wink:
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Re: Hogs in Ontario?

Post by Hi5 » Thu May 16, 2019 6:28 pm

I suspect that Nog has nailed it.

By the way, the Ontario Fish and Wildlife Act, prohibits "night hunting" and artificial light for hunting, but in relation to hunting "wildlife".

"Wildlife" is defined as follows: "wildlife” means an animal that belongs to a species that is wild by nature, and includes game wildlife and specially protected wildlife. "

So, depending on how the courts have interpreted "wild by nature", maybe it's legal to hunt wild boar with lights. Those pigs sure aren't "wild by nature" to Ontario. Nature didn't put them there. The last time pigs were wild by nature in North America was before the last ice age, and those pigs aren't the same species we have now. The ones we have now are all imports. If you want to hunt Axis deer, surely you don"t have to have a hunting licence, and hunt follow regulations set for "wildlife".

However, please don't take my word for this before you go blasting pigs at night with a spotlight. Better talk to an Ontario lawyer, but you shouldn't be seen as a looney to be asking.....
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Fazan
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Re: Hogs in Ontario?

Post by Fazan » Thu May 16, 2019 10:17 pm

Hi5 wrote:
Thu May 16, 2019 6:28 pm
However, please don't take my word for this before you go blasting pigs at night with a spotlight. Better talk to an Ontario lawyer, but you shouldn't be seen as a looney to be asking.....
Personally, I have no intention of hunting them, day or night, even if I see one, before I see the rules.
All I am saying is: IF they are here that should be acknowledged, defined and regulated by autorities. And I haven't ever seen any mention of them in hunting regulations.
As for "imports", European hare (commonly referred as jack rabbit by hunters) is one of those in Ontario. Categorized as "wild animal" and regulated under small game in Ontario Hunting Regulations. Correct me if I am wrong.
And I think we are going bit too far with this discussion. I was just surprised to see this article on the net and hogs never mentioned as species (wild or not) in any official hunting publication in Ontario that I've seen.
Cheers!
Fazan

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Re: Hogs in Ontario?

Post by Hi5 » Fri May 17, 2019 1:19 pm

Fazan, my friend, we are simply having a respectful discussion.

Unless the law makes something illegal, it is considered legal. So, it's no surprise that Ontario hunting laws and regulations are silent on the subject of feral pigs. It seems nobody noticed until now that you even had any.

Manitoba had a problem with some that escaped from a farm, and they began to thrive and multiply and became a concern. There weren't any laws or regulations passed as a result (as I recall), and in the hunting brochures that were distributed, it was merely stated that there was no season or licencing for feral pigs, and hunters could take any amount they wanted. Safety rules that applied to any hunting would, however, be in effect, as would rules relating to trespassing, etc. So, no new laws or regulations were created.

Other than raising tax money by selling feral pig licences, I can't think of any reason why the government should even get involved. If feral pigs are a nuisance, they should be treated as a nuisance. The only people who might find it a problem if pigs could be shot in anyway, anywhere, anytime, (limited only by safety concerns and trespass concerns) would be Big Game enforcement. They might have more difficulty in determining whether someone is trying to poach deer or pig hunting. That would likely be the main resistance to open season on pigs. Heck, even the bunny huggers would be upset to see the damage those pigs can do, and they aren't even naturally occurring wildlife.

I'm pushing this discussion a bit, and I hope that it might encourage people to take some leadership with this issue. The solution to the problem doesn't have to come from the government making new laws and regulations. You don't need to buy more hunting "licences". All you need is for your government to say "Go ahead. We aren't involved".
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Fazan
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Re: Hogs in Ontario?

Post by Fazan » Sat May 18, 2019 5:13 pm

"If feral pigs are a nuisance, they should be treated as a nuisance. "
As are raccoons in the City of Toronto. Try to touch one😣.
Couple years ago I am sitting in my spam having a coffee and watching City TV morning news. There comes live broadcast of an arrest of a guy that got frustrated with racoons and threw an object after mother and three young ones in his backyard. Happend to hit one of young ones. Someone saw it and called police. Arrested (televised) and charged for animal cruelty. Now, I guess he needed a lawyer...
Unless you are a lawyer most of time you enter the court you loose. Even if you win the case. Time and nerves at least.
What you say happend in Manitoba with pigs I understand. Authorities gave a green light to exterminate them. All good.
If you check fishing regulations there is a section where they are talking about invasive species (aquatic) and message is: kill them by all means. Clear.
Hogs? I don't know. And don't want to find that out on the court. Right or wrong.

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Fazan
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Re: Hogs in Ontario?

Post by Fazan » Sat May 18, 2019 5:18 pm

Why when I wright "cooking room" comes out as a "spam"?
Checked three times and it happens all the time.
Because someone was advertising them here while back?

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Re: Hogs in Ontario?

Post by Boo » Sat May 18, 2019 6:37 pm

I'm of the opinion that as long as it isn't spelled out as illegal in the law books, just do it. In the country, getting in trouble for whacking a coon, let alone a hog destroying your property just isn't going to get you in trouble.
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janesy
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Re: Hogs in Ontario?

Post by janesy » Sun May 19, 2019 5:47 am

Fazan wrote:
Sat May 18, 2019 5:18 pm
Why when I wright "cooking room" comes out as a "spam"?
Checked three times and it happens all the time.
Because someone was advertising them here while back?
Does it for me to
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Re: Hogs in Ontario?

Post by ihunt » Sun May 19, 2019 10:15 am

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Czy_Horse
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Re: Hogs in Ontario?

Post by Czy_Horse » Sun May 19, 2019 2:25 pm

SSS, Shoot Shovel Shutup

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Reinyrooster
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Re: Hogs in Ontario?

Post by Reinyrooster » Sun May 19, 2019 8:27 pm

I thought it was laid out pretty clearly in the memorandum from the MNR that was attached that hunters may kill these pigs under authority of a small game licence.
Where's the confusion?

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Fazan
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Re: Hogs in Ontario?

Post by Fazan » Sun May 19, 2019 9:15 pm

If you are talking about memorandum from one of Boo's attachments that one was issued by MNR 2014 for residents of United Counties of Prescott and Russell.
Does it apply 2019 in say Georgina or Magnetawan or Flamborough? What are MNR directions for this year for the whole province of Ontario?
Or the problem is no longer there?
According to that article and to the map with attached photos of hogs sightings (from other Boo's attachment) problem is still very much there. But memorandums or any other directives from MNR are not.
By keeping this tread alive I am hoping we can get attention of someone from MNR who is browsing this forum to catch people doing something wrong and bragging about that on hunting forum :D
Last edited by Fazan on Mon May 20, 2019 9:43 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Reinyrooster
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Re: Hogs in Ontario?

Post by Reinyrooster » Mon May 20, 2019 11:59 am

As the Ministry of Natural Resources is a province body governing a provincial statute, my understanding would by that whatever licencing stipulations apply in one area would apply throughout the province.
Having said that, that's just my understanding, not gospel.
For the sake of the landowners, I hope the pigs don't get as out of hand as there are in many of the states. I went to Florida a few years ago to hunt them and when you see the damage they do to the property, it's sad. It's like a rototiller went through the field.
Having said that, if they get to be a problem here, it would be much more fun hunting them locally vs having to go to the states.

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