Long limb vs. short limb

Crossbow Hunting

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bcbuckblaster
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Long limb vs. short limb

Post by bcbuckblaster » Sun Aug 25, 2019 1:50 pm

I was just reading a thread where a member had a broken limb with a micro 335. While reading some responses I came across a reply from vixenmaster that said he no longer had any short limb models for this reason, only long limb. Not wanting to derail this thread, I thought that I would start a new one and pose this question.

Now I realize that the Axiom and Vixen II are "true" long limbers, and that the micros are short and stout, but where does that leave the Matrix models?

Would you consider the Matrix lineup, more specifically the Bulldog 400 a short limb or long limb crossbow? I guess it would be a "medium" length limb?

Just curious as I am really interested in this model before it becomes obsolete. It is being discontinued, although there are a few packages that are still available as I type this. The other thing that I like is that the Bulldog 400 can still be hand cocked vs. the almost mandatory cocking devices needed for the newest models available in the Excalibur lineup.

I like my Axiom, although I am really interested in having something with some more "horsepower" for hunting, since I do hunt open country and would like to be able to take a little further shots on deer. Also would like more power to possibly hunt moose with it one day.

I'm also 6' feet tall and prefer a larger crossbow like the bulldog. I went to the store and tried a few on, and the 400 definitely fits me better than a micro or Grizzly model.

So, does the Bulldog 400 have the potential to be a problem free and reliable hunting bow that will last a lifetime, like Excalibur's old meat and potato models? Thanks in advance for any insight on this.

georgiaboy
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Re: Long limb vs. short limb

Post by georgiaboy » Sun Aug 25, 2019 2:16 pm

I have one of each...Matrix bulldog 380, Matrix 350LE, a micro 355 and a Vixen II.
The only one I’ve had an issue with is the 350LE, limb splinter last year and Excalibur had me a new set of limbs in less than a week.
The micro is definitely the most stout to hand cock. The Matrix is the middle of the pack but I wouldn’t hesitate buying any of the three models. Excalibur has your back no matter what.
Bulldog m380 blackout
Micro 355
Matrix 350LE
Vixen II
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xcaliber
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Re: Long limb vs. short limb

Post by xcaliber » Sun Aug 25, 2019 2:35 pm

Agree on the customer service, and the statements on various models. If you have a model that you love, and travel to hunt, or hunt a lot, get a spare set of limbs to have on hand just in case, or another bow.

Good Luck deciding!
Matrix 330 (Xylia) Bushnell Trophy XLT / Single Stage Trigger Tech
Micro 355 (Jinx) Nikon Bolt XR. TT Single Stage Trigger
Matrix 380 (Max) Redfield Revenge / TT Single Stage Trigger
Axe 340 Kryptek (Axe) Nikon P3 Will be completed 8-31-19

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BrotherRon
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Re: Long limb vs. short limb

Post by BrotherRon » Sun Aug 25, 2019 5:03 pm

I'm no pro on this topic but most of the research I have done on the Matrix line points to the higher poundage models having most of the problems.
That said, I believe they have made changes to the riser to counter some of the issues.
(I believe there were also other issues involved which were also addressed).. seems I heard something about over cooked limbs.
I have never had an issue with my 310 or my 330 before I sold it.
My next purchase will be a BD 330 as I believe it is one of the most reliable crossbows on the market, and big enough to handle any North american big game. :wink:
Matrix 310 ~ Hawke XB30 Pro SR ~TT~Tombstone Case.
36" All Weather Tactical Case. Danny Miller Top Mount Quiver
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janesy
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Re: Long limb vs. short limb

Post by janesy » Sun Aug 25, 2019 7:46 pm

bcbuckblaster wrote:
Sun Aug 25, 2019 1:50 pm
I was just reading a thread where a member had a broken limb with a micro 335. While reading some responses I came across a reply from vixenmaster that said he no longer had any short limb models for this reason, only long limb. Not wanting to derail this thread, I thought that I would start a new one and pose this question.

Now I realize that the Axiom and Vixen II are "true" long limbers, and that the micros are short and stout, but where does that leave the Matrix models?

Would you consider the Matrix lineup, more specifically the Bulldog 400 a short limb or long limb crossbow? I guess it would be a "medium" length limb?

Just curious as I am really interested in this model before it becomes obsolete. It is being discontinued, although there are a few packages that are still available as I type this. The other thing that I like is that the Bulldog 400 can still be hand cocked vs. the almost mandatory cocking devices needed for the newest models available in the Excalibur lineup.

I like my Axiom, although I am really interested in having something with some more "horsepower" for hunting, since I do hunt open country and would like to be able to take a little further shots on deer. Also would like more power to possibly hunt moose with it one day.

I'm also 6' feet tall and prefer a larger crossbow like the bulldog. I went to the store and tried a few on, and the 400 definitely fits me better than a micro or Grizzly model.

So, does the Bulldog 400 have the potential to be a problem free and reliable hunting bow that will last a lifetime, like Excalibur's old meat and potato models? Thanks in advance for any insight on this.
I have had or still have,
Micro 308, 310, 315, 335G1, 335G2x2 , 345, 355, 360 and 370.
All micros and all various components if not stock and a dozen sets of limbs or more between them all.
I've have one limb splinter after I decocked it with a stringing aid not installed correctly. That was on the 370 last year.
The new batch of limbs are nearly fool proof. I would say that if you do your part, the chances of any model having issues these days is slim. Very slim .
Has any one heard of a suppressor limb failure? That model is 3 years old now.
Micro-Hybrid-bulldog "PitBull370"
MOBU Micro BD345 "Greener"
Xtra Micro BD310 "Small-Fry"
Micro Axe MOBU.

Every little sound in the bush sounds like footsteps... Until you hear footsteps!

longbow joe
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Re: Long limb vs. short limb

Post by longbow joe » Sun Aug 25, 2019 8:22 pm

Just like a car or any motor vehicle..more speed more horsepower more problems. The long limbers and matrix bows under 350 fps rarely have a limb issue. I will choose a reliable model over a fast one any day.
I do own a first generation micro that's been put thru hell with o issue l must add.
Micro 335 camo crossbones /matrix 330 nikon bolt /vixen ll / offspring with a micro stock crossbones/ matrix 355 with a micro stock crossbones/ metal ibex (adopted manco morto)/Phoenix/ trigger tec's /xacts/super freak ex's/ spitfires/zombies

Smong2000
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Re: Long limb vs. short limb

Post by Smong2000 » Mon Aug 26, 2019 8:49 am

I had a Micro 355 limb deconstruct while I was holding it, definitely a high energy event. I have a BD400, (now for sale) that developed a big splinter with no drama. Both were covered by warranty and repaired, the Micro sold unfired and the BD400 was repaired with latest generation limbs and is currently being shot on occasion. A gambler would put better odds on the shorter limbed, higher pound bows being most 'fragile' and longest limb low pound bows being most reliable.

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ComfyBear
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Re: Long limb vs. short limb

Post by ComfyBear » Mon Aug 26, 2019 9:21 am

Over the last 30 years, I have owned most of the Exo-series, and I never encountered any limb issues. The problem began with the "need for speed", and the introduction of the shorter limb bows, i.e. Matrix & Micros. On both my Matrix 405 and 380 I had small slivers develop. Apparently the transition to shorter limbs caused "growing pains", and there was a "learning curve".

However, now that Excalibur has beefed up their limbs, whether short limb or long, it is my belief that the limb issues of the past have been addressed and rectified. That doesn't mean that we will not hear about limb issue now. Since there's still older versions of the limbs and risers out there, I will not be surprised to hear of the odd limb issue.
ComfyBear
Micro Axe 340, Matrix 380, Matrix 355, Matrix 350, Exocet 200
ComfyBear Custom Strings
G5 Montecs 125gr., SlickTrick 125 gr. Magnums

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vixenmaster
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Re: Long limb vs. short limb

Post by vixenmaster » Mon Aug 26, 2019 9:45 am

My learnin curve wid the short limbs has ended. The older i get the less i want things breakin n tired of shippin limbs back fer new ones. Jus tired of it, others may not mind it, i have had at least a dz. sets of limbs break over the past 6 yrs. Unless i come across one heck of a deal on another long limber i am done wid short limbed recurves. I have learned a 6 yr hard nosed lesson
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ComfyBear
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Re: Long limb vs. short limb

Post by ComfyBear » Mon Aug 26, 2019 11:30 am

vixenmaster wrote:
Mon Aug 26, 2019 9:45 am
My learnin curve wid the short limbs has ended. The older i get the less i want things breakin n tired of shippin limbs back fer new ones. Jus tired of it, others may not mind it, i have had at least a dz. sets of limbs break over the past 6 yrs. Unless i come across one heck of a deal on another long limber i am done wid short limbed recurves. I have learned a 6 yr hard nosed lesson
Mike, sorry to hear that you've had more problems than most with your limbs. Either you're one of the most unluckiest fellows I know, or there are other underlying factors.
I know that the Exo-series crossbows have been bullet-proof over the years, however I've heard of a few having issues. A lot of times it's not the crossbow that is the issue, but rather how the crossbow is treated. Personally I strive to handle my crossbows with care. I use heavier arrows than those that are used to advertise the crossbow's maximum speed. More importantly, I use strings that are heavier than the factory ones.

As a string maker, I know that Flemish Strings are hand-made and their quality depends on the string maker. Over the last 15 years of making strings, and using different material, I've learned that it's not only the material, but more importantly the number of strands used and how the string is made.

Personally, I use BCY 8190 (SK90) and BCY 8125G (SK75), but instead of the recommended 26-28 strands, I use 36 to make my strings. Using my strings, the only problem I've encountered with my limbs were two small slivers, one on my Matrix Mega 405 and the other my Matrix 380. Both those bows had the earlier limbs.

That makes me wonder, could all of your limb issue problems have stemmed from the strings you use?
ComfyBear
Micro Axe 340, Matrix 380, Matrix 355, Matrix 350, Exocet 200
ComfyBear Custom Strings
G5 Montecs 125gr., SlickTrick 125 gr. Magnums

He is served best, he who serves himself.
Cavendi sunt qui dona ferens.

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Carnivorous
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Re: Long limb vs. short limb

Post by Carnivorous » Mon Aug 26, 2019 12:17 pm

ComfyBear wrote:
Mon Aug 26, 2019 11:30 am
vixenmaster wrote:
Mon Aug 26, 2019 9:45 am
My learnin curve wid the short limbs has ended. The older i get the less i want things breakin n tired of shippin limbs back fer new ones. Jus tired of it, others may not mind it, i have had at least a dz. sets of limbs break over the past 6 yrs. Unless i come across one heck of a deal on another long limber i am done wid short limbed recurves. I have learned a 6 yr hard nosed lesson
Mike, sorry to hear that you've had more problems than most with your limbs. Either you're one of the most unluckiest fellows I know, or there are other underlying factors.
I know that the Exo-series crossbows have been bullet-proof over the years, however I've heard of a few having issues. A lot of times it's not the crossbow that is the issue, but rather how the crossbow is treated. Personally I strive to handle my crossbows with care. I use heavier arrows than those that are used to advertise the crossbow's maximum speed. More importantly, I use strings that are heavier than the factory ones.

As a string maker, I know that Flemish Strings are hand-made and their quality depends on the string maker. Over the last 15 years of making strings, and using different material, I've learned that it's not only the material, but more importantly the number of strands used and how the string is made.

Personally, I use BCY 8190 (SK90) and BCY 8125G (SK75), but instead of the recommended 26-28 strands, I use 36 to make my strings. Using my strings, the only problem I've encountered with my limbs were two small slivers, one on my Matrix Mega 405 and the other my Matrix 380. Both those bows had the earlier limbs.

That makes me wonder, could all of your limb issue problems have stemmed from the strings you use?
That's interesting info. I like a heavier string as well. I can see a light string with a 350gr arrow could be bad news for the limbs..
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Timbrhuntr
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Re: Long limb vs. short limb

Post by Timbrhuntr » Mon Aug 26, 2019 12:46 pm

I had my exomag for over 20 years with no major limb issues . I have had my micro for around 4 and am on the 4th set of limbs and I am seeing cracks in them so I have a second set so I don't get screwed out west again. :thumbdown:

vixenmaster
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Re: Long limb vs. short limb

Post by vixenmaster » Mon Aug 26, 2019 1:15 pm

I knowed i would catch grief over my post. So be it, i had one 380 Matrix that was returned because it had 3 sets of limbs break or splinter or the mag tip break off before i ever got to shot it wid the Factory 28 strand string. So yer tellin me it must be my strings that caused it but Factory strings at 28 strands don't! I use 28 n 32 strands of Force 10 a stronger n thicker dia. material than the D97. No matter what you think want throw out to members i have not abused my crossbows, i usually use 400 gr arrows on up to my 658 gr ones i use to break shoulders
Limb Breakin Half Bubble Off BD360
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deadeer
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Re: Long limb vs. short limb

Post by deadeer » Mon Aug 26, 2019 1:39 pm

Lol. Mike's strings are the cause! That's laughable. That would be about half of the bows out there better let go. :roll:

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janesy
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Re: Long limb vs. short limb

Post by janesy » Mon Aug 26, 2019 2:44 pm

:eusa-popcorn: I have been waiting for months for a genuine reason to use the popcorn emoji!
Micro-Hybrid-bulldog "PitBull370"
MOBU Micro BD345 "Greener"
Xtra Micro BD310 "Small-Fry"
Micro Axe MOBU.

Every little sound in the bush sounds like footsteps... Until you hear footsteps!

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